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I like those odds,it was £70mil but the delay will cost the aquisitor dearly.....£80mil kick off £100mill within 12 weeks of listing
*70m & 100m
Yes Baz,
There is no way you float on the main market with 7,042,568,560 shares (or 10billion+ if the deal is resurrected with the same multiplier) with the SP at fractions of a penny.
So that becomes 70m+ or 100m+ shares in circulation and £2 is a nice middle of the road figure at 7m (£1.40 at 10m)
The value of your holding would still be worth a hypothetical £20, consolidated or not.
So Kentan, if I hypothetically have 1000 shares, after consolidation I will have 10 shares in the new listing? Valued at £20? Assuming what you say happens
My uneducated guess:
It will come to the main market after a 1 for 100 consolidation at £2.00 per share.
Perhaps we should open a book on the m/cap.
£70m ... 2/1
£100m ... 11/4
£120m ... 3/1
£150m+ ... 5/1
No problem Baz, let's hope the goose lays the golden egg for us all, we deserve it having been so patient and trusting...
I hope the "Mob" are not behind all these shenanigans, wanting their payola from the deal.
Our image has also been rebranded:
"Coal" is a dirty word in an environmentally friendly world, emissions from burning it are causing all sorts of problems to global warming and pollution. Just look at Mongolia and it's capital Ulan Bator, now Ulaanbaatar, it is virtually toxic to breathe the air. Alternative, cleaner forms of energy are replacing coal everywhere.
But lucky old us we have ..."Anthracite" .... used to be called coal, looks like coal, smells like coal, but with its low sulphur burn and clean bill of health is now referred to as "Carbon" ... hence the name change to Atlantic Carbon Group. ...
From now on, never mention the "C" word...
"Darling, can you put some more "Carbon" on the fire"?
"Yes, Darling, I will fetch the carbon scuttle" ... "Has the carbon man been this week"?
And I come from a family of "Carbon Merchants" ... LoL!
thanks for the explanation kentan
Aim??.......because it’s manipulated,poorly regulated and the big bucks steer clear.........main market is highly regulated,and because of that the money flows in........
As I said a few weeks ago Pagnotti junior is an advisor to Mr Best.....I will take some of that cosying up all day long if it gets us first shout on the family land bank......
I got the impression that they were endeavouring to list on the main market rather than AIM.
If this is the case why cannot they relist on AIM?
Anyone know?
gla
Matt
From the statement issued by ACG last October 2018:
"Management is in talks with Pagnotti, the largest landowner in the Northeast Pennsylvania Anthracite Fields, to control additional reserves and has identified several potential targets."
This will require finance to secure a future beyond the conservatively estimated 17-20 years life of mine at present, but they know what is there and so does the landowner Pagnotti (Louis) and the increased value of it, so it will not be cheap.
I notice that Louis Pagnotti jr. does not hold any shares publicly in ACG (unless with nominee status) ... and he hails from a very chequered family dynasty:
https://mafia.fandom.com/wiki/Louis_Pagnotti
More skeletons in the cupboard to be revealed as this saga continues.... Godfather IV in the making!
As stated by them they will continue to look for another way in which to realise shareholder value.
They could do a divi, likely hood I think now is pay down debt and keep investing in all the different licences and areas to get the mines working even better?
We need results to understand where they currently are, could come at anytime dependant on what they are thinking, past tendency seems to be leave as long as possible.
The global market is strong, the anthricite price has increased, costs have come down as demand goes up so everything is in their favour. Just a question of how this value is released so that everyone from the original position doesn't have loads of shares and no cash.
Likewise George may own loads of land but it's worth nothing if you can't mine it affectively.
Results are only 8 to 10 weeks away, by then maybe another route has been found.
I don’t think any of the other main 3 will be interested in acg. There far bigger, global and looking at synergy and removing non core, not adding.
This will be more investment to make money from finance people. One will give up his land and licences to let acg In to mine and the other will provide the ability to mine. George said himself two years ago he was getting two old and needed a good way out
Baz,
Cloud Energy are still trading but delisted last month from the main market and now trade on the Over The Counter Market (OTC:CLDP) called The Pink Market. This was caused by the low price of domestic coal in USA due to the mild winter and low demand from power stations and oversupply throughout the World. They employ around 1,300 people mining coal cheaply by open cast surface methods in The Powder River Basin, Wyoming and Montana. Their m/cap and share price dropped alarmingly from a high in January 2018 (boosted by the Trump effect) to a fraction of that now.
This clearly demonstrates the difference between Cloud Energy and Atlantic Carbon, one has a declining demand product in huge stockpiles, against the other which has a niche product (anthracite) with increasing demand and price, to build and strengthen its position.
That is why ACG now need to get back to the main market as soon as possible to take advantage in a fickle industry where prices and values are volatile. It also makes it a prime takeover target with consolidated growth potential.
*** cloud energy (cld) in that link isn't trading anymore and filed for bankruptcy... What does this mean!!!
Just read the link kentan... I hate reading stuff like that, its make me think a Bentley continental is on the cards..lol.
But seriously, in beginner terms, are you saying an established company/group can buy up ACG for around £150-£200mil? What value would this place on our shares/new shares? I literally have no clue what the market cap etc means in terms of out shares
4 likely big-time predators should they take a liking to ACG:
https://www.investopedia.com/investing/coal-stocks/
With a m/cap of $150m to $200m (£120m-£150m) and they pay a 25% premium for the privilege, it could be a t/o at around £150m-£190m to make the principles all mega rich..... and peanuts for the multi-billion $ multinationals to find and improve their balance sheets for the next 20 years.
Good posts guys,certificate arrived back in post today, we roll on! george
Dawto,
Yes, it is a den of iniquity and intrigue. ... who would you trust in this saga?
It appears you have the career coal miners, George Roskos III and Steve Best, versus, the money men, stockbrokers Adam Wilson and Peter Shea.
Roskos has benefited by the merger of his run-down Hazleton Shaft with Atlantic Carbon to utilise the Komatsu plant and machinery, that ACG has virtually mortgaged itself for, to undertake the new efficient method of open shaft mining.
The same for Best, he needed finance for ATC and Wilson was his man to do it with his track record.
Subsequently, the renamed company (ACG) has turned itself around with the benefit of President Trump's initiatives and tariffs.
The intention of bringing ACG back to the stock market is to realise the group's highly increased value and make all the directors and large shareholders incredibly rich ... and richer still if they were seen as a takeover target by a multinational.... but Roskos would lose control of his "baby" (Hazleton Mine) and Best (Stockton) ... the money men usually win out, because without them you have no finance and are dead in the water.
Good assessment kentan.....I also have a feeling ACG know the results will be very good in May/June so on that basis they don’t have to rush into anything......I feel the revised offer will be forthcoming at a reduced percentage to DS because our potential market cap will be higher.........
I’m aiming for a new offer just after the late spring early summer results
Kentan, fabulous bit of forensic research; my gut feel was that the whole deal stank to high heaven but I didn't have your energy to look into it too much as this whole saga has made me lose the will to live.
My shallow assessment was that DSS had decided that getting into bed with this bunch of shysters would leave them open to regulatory scrutiny, but with your exposure it is obviously a case of "falling out among thieves". A terrific example of "get into bed with tigers, end up with scratches"
With Adam Wilson having a foot in both camps,(ACG & DSS), a present and former CEO of both, it all seems a bit incestuous and bound to have created a conflict of interest.
He was a major shareholder (16.9%) after being appointed CEO of DSS in Sept 2009 but probably sold his holding when he resigned 8 months later in May 2010.
It appears it was no coincidence when the loss-making DSS announced it was de-listing from AIM in January 2016, 1 month after the heavily indebted ATC had done similar. The Cynic in me makes me believe that the seeds for this RTO were conveniently sown before this happened, a cosy relationship existing between Peter Shea(DSS) & Adam Wilson(ATC) from their association in the past. .... ie. "let's both de-list and come back together, 3 years later, as a bigger and better company" ... "I will get my stooge and co-conspirator, a major shareholder in ACG, Stuart Thomas, to make the announcement and call for an EGM" said Wilson.
I notice from their listings at Companies House, both companies have charges levied against them. In the case of DSS it is in the form of a debenture from Epsilon Investments Ltd pte, based in Singapore and a second from Anglo Irish Bank which are outstanding, whereas ACG has a $21m loan facility that remains on the books.
Interestingly a company calling itself Epsilon Investments Ltd incorporated itself on March 22nd 2019 at Companies House ... run by an Israeli businessman Ziv Aviram, in the business of real estate. ... could this be another cog in the works?
What we don't know yet, for sure, what caused the deal to fall through at the 11th hour. We need to know this as it is fundamental to a future merger, RTO or just getting into bed with another previously market quoted company (shell) that is lying dormant at present.
Because neither are quoted companies there is no call for an RNS.
The cosy relationship that exists between DSS & ACG makes me think that they will come back with a revised offer in the next 3 months, meanwhile, ACG will grow richer and more valuable from the strong increase in demand and price for anthracite.
I that article sums up the pond life that can sit in wait inside a shell.......ATC were having none of it.....bring on the revised offer and some lubricant.....
Another nice explanation of private companies rolling into cash shells
https://www.growthbusiness.co.uk/what-is-a-cash-shell-1047072/
Digit4lis thanks for this. It really does explain why ATC are approaching things this way. Its my feeling that the DSS deal is not off the table and I suspect a new offer will surface in a renegotiated form. When? Well thats anyones guess but I just don't feel this is dead and buried yet.
Just a snippet on the advantages of reversing into a cash shell
Advantages of Reverse Mergers
A Simplified Process
Reverse mergers allow a private company to become public without raising capital, which considerably simplifies the process. While conventional IPOs can take months (even over a calendar year) to materialize, reverse mergers can take only a few weeks to complete (in some cases, in as little as 30 days). This saves management a lot of time and energy, ensuring that there is sufficient time devoted to running the company.