London South East prides itself on its community spirit, and in order to keep the chat section problem free, we ask all members to follow these simple rules. In these rules, we refer to ourselves as "we", "us", "our". The user of the website is referred to as "you" and "your".
By posting on our share chat boards you are agreeing to the following:
You will only have one login account. Registering with multiple accounts is not allowed. Any user found to have more than one account on this site will have all, and any future accounts suspended permanently.
Your email and password must only be used by you. If a post is made under your account, it will be considered that it was posted by yourself.
Your account nickname must not be the same, or contain, listed company names or board members' names.
While debating and discussion is fine, we will not tolerate; rudeness, swearing, insulting posts, personal attacks, or posts which are invasive of another's privacy.
You will not;
discuss illegal or criminal activities.
post any confidential or price sensitive information or that is not public knowledge.
post misleading or false statements regarding the share price and performance. Such posts are deemed as market abuse, and may be reported to the appropriate authorities.
post any private communication, or part thereof, from any other person, including from a member of the board of directors of a listed company. Such posts cannot be verified as true and could be deemed to be misleading.
post any personal details (e.g. email address or phone number).
post live price or level 2 updates.
publish content that is not your original work, or infringes the copyright or other rights of any third party.
post non-constructive, meaningless, one word (or short) non-sense posts.
post links to, or otherwise publish any content containing any form of advertising, promotion for goods and services, spam, or other unsolicited communication.
post any affiliate or referral links, or post anything asking for a referral.
post or otherwise publish any content unrelated to the board or the board's topic.
re-post premium share chat posts on regular share chat.
restrict or inhibit any other user from using the boards.
impersonate any person or entity, including any of our employees or representatives.
post or transmit any content that contains software viruses, files or code designed to interrupt, destroy or limit the functionality of this website or any computer software or equipment.
If you are going to post non-English, please also post an English translation of your post.
If you are going to post non-English, please also post an English translation of your post.
The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. As a user you agree to any information you have entered being stored in a database. You agree that we have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic or board at any time should we see fit. You agree that we have the right to remove any post without notice. You agree that we have the right to suspend your account without notice.
Please note some users may not behave properly and may post content that is misleading, untrue or offensive.
It is not possible for us to fully monitor all content all of the time but where we have actually received notice of any content that is potentially misleading, untrue, offensive, unlawful, infringes third party rights or is potentially in breach of these terms and conditions, then we will review such content, decide whether to remove it from this website and act accordingly.
Premium and Verified Members
Premium Members are members that have a premium subscription with London South East and have access to Premium Chat. You can subscribe here.
London South East does not endorse such members, and posts should not be construed as advice and represent the opinions of the authors, not those of London South East Ltd, or its affiliates.
Westh1 -- good points. I hate conspiracy theories but I wonder if Francis downplayed this on purpose a little. This will allow his work to shine brighter later on (and the sp to skyrocket). This allowed him today to put on the mantle of the calm and confident CEO who buys in the company when others sell. And he also loaded up on the cheap (although I don't believe this last point was his sole aim).
Debcashew -- Many thanks for your good words. The same apply to you too of course.
Rollhatdice -- Since you're asking, I'm a Senior Lecturer in Economics at a university in England. I'm not a professor but I might be one day. I specialise in Macroeconomics and, recently, in Behavioural Economics (which is funny because the area is mostly microeconomics, not macroeconomics).
Having a PhD in Economics means close to nothing when it comes to the stockmarket though... Economists make lousy investors actually (with the notable exception of JM Keynes of course). Indicatively, the 2012 nobel prize in economics went jointly to two economists who supported completely opposite and opposing views on the stockmarket (https://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/oct/14/american-nobel-prize-economics-fama-hansen-shiller)). Eugene Fama supports that the market incorporates all information and is always fair and rational. Robert Schiller supported that the market is subject to ups and downs generated by panics, overoptimism and even... hearsay. He supports that markets are irrational. I always tell my students that our discipline is confused. The greatest virtue of an economist is to understand when to ignore theory and when to take it seriously.
Trends, some good points there mate & yes you are right about posting after hours! In regard to profitability returning, what do you make of the proposals/business plan to achieve this. Seems wooly to me and very little about the progress and in the way of further detail today. Personally I’m thankful there are two CD&R personnel on the board.
Slightly ironic that Francis gets to spend some of his bonus money on cheap shares before delivering any value to his shareholders, talk about a win win situation for the boss. I don't expect life to be fair but it is immoral that he trousered that cash before turning this around. Put it this way, when do you reckon shareholders might get to see their bonus in the form of a dividend, two, three or four years?
I understand your gripes @Westh1. I know it's still loss making but the company is now valued at £285 million. This is about 15-20% of annual revenues. There is clear scope for a re-rate here given this 1.5-2 billion revenues and narrowing of losses. No going concern issues, unlike a lot of companies at the moment. Just need to stay patient. I think a trading range between 23 - 30 pence for the next couple of months and then up to 50-60 pence early next year. a £600 million market cap is clearly achievable once profitability returns. A macro environment like February to July 2020 will hopefully never be seen again in my life time. Obviously a lot of people jumping ship but IMO the ship is turning and in my experience that is the best time to buy recovery shares!
Of course the sp will recover. The wait will just be longer than many of us imagined. Whilst the negative results were expected I think the lack of notable positives and substance in regard to future plans, sent this crashing today. The RNS didn’t make me feel massively optimistic for the future and was written very lacklustre. A shame really because I should imagine there is significant change happening behind the scenes and a lot more detail which could have been shared.
And many of us are pretty much aligned with that, give or take, no matter how Francis came by the shares. Just another general benchmark, if you like, and not normally considered a bad position to be in in a recovery situation, particularly as against some longer termers, institutional and otherwise.
Quite surprised by the market reaction to today's announcement. The trading to June was pretty much already known by the market and the comments on the post period trading were quite cautiously good and indeed previous guidance was raised. The market can be a mysterious place but I fully expect a return to the placing price over the next month. Good opportunity to average down if you are a position to do so IMO.
Union -- there's nothing wrong in waiting for a company to improve/recover and then the share to pick up as a result. In fact, that's what the best investors do.
The UK markets are now about 25% lower than where they would be without the pandemic. The pandemic will probably be history in less than 12 months for the UK and that idiotic Brexit will be sorted one way or another by early 2021.
2021 will be full of tailwinds for this share and all other shares. I just hope that SIG will recover far and beyond that generic 25% I mentioned.
I need to do some urgent work and won't be posting more here today. Good luck with your investments Union.
So your theory is no more than wait a share out and after maybe many year you might make a profit. I’m afraid that is not a strategy........CD&R have pegged the share back to 25p - that is where you need to be - not the 30p IKO raise to be aligned to the prospects of the company now. The signals were there in the share price over the last two weeks......this was a caller this morning.
I couldn't see SIG's webcast because I'm at work at uni.
I have to admit though, I expected a little better results today. We all knew they wouldn't be great results and there wouldn't be profit though. Plus the macroeconomic environment with national lockdown on the cards and BoJo's Brexit doesn't help. Short-term investors sold out and run. Now the share price is at its bottom or very close to the bottom.
We are now at the darkest point but I know this will rise again. 2021 will be full of good news. Brexit will have settled and the economy will be growing fast as BoE and all think tanks predict. Construction will be center stage of the recovery. And insulation initiatives will have kicked in.
SIG are on their way to recovery already. I believe that. They will up their game, will recapture market share and turn this around. 2021 will be good news after good news and 2022 will hopefully see this company and share closer to former glories.
I wasn't going to sell for a quick today (like a few of you planned to do). I'm a medium/long-term investor, not a trader. Believe it or not, I've never lost money on a share longer-term. Well, except for the very first one I bought in the 90s.
We are at the lowest point and from here on it will be up. With ups and downs, but generally up. CD&R invested at 35p for a reason. And IKO invested even more money at 30p for a reason too.