Charles Jillings, CEO of Utilico, energized by strong economic momentum across Latin America. Watch the video here.
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as i posted earlier Ivy ... to get an antibody response you have to generate T cells ... its not an addition ...
""The primary immune response of the body to antigen occurs on the first occasion it is encountered. ... The humoral response, mediated by B cells with the help of T cells, produces high-affinity and antigen-specific antibodies""
Agree Inanaco but also manages to generate a T cell response in addition to the antibody response which is mainly associated with the Spike GP.
I have already said I believe the SCLP approach should theoretically offer a better overall response but just needs more news on human data and the development funding sorted.
Ivy - re. your 20.22, I can imagine and to answer your original question, yes, it would have to be in a controlled and secure environment.
Inanaco - my understanding is that challenge trials would involve injecting patients with live virus but not sure it matters, the point is that by some method they are exposed to live virus.
Ivy
"""Based purely on my understanding of the theory I would expect a better response from the SCLP Vax especially in the specific T and helper cell response as it targets the nucleo capsid protein in a more potent way than the Oxford ChAd Vax.""
Oxfords Vaccine only targets the spike Glycoprotein only
Does anybody know how much time volunteers will have to spend in a virus isolation unit.
Thinking about jsands observation about volunteers from H.M.P leading to remission, which I guess will be cost effective in time too.
Evening Burble a very fair point and yes SCLP has the capacity to stimulate a more flexible immune response against a wider antigenic threat.
Despite what some may think I see great benefits in the SCLP Approach but the specific need to develop an effective Vax in these unprecedented times may not work in our favour.
Hi Bermuda,
As you say the demand for Covid 19 human challenge studies seems to be growing.
The CEO of the only U.K. commercial lab claims that 12/20 of the top Covid 19 Vax candidates have been talking to them and looks like Oxford are considering doing It
Ivy
One thing to point out with an adenovirus mediated transfer such as ChadOx1 is the potential to develop antibodies against the actual delivery system, hence if this became the chosen route for vaccination against C-19, it in turn also prevent it being used for any other virally delivered vaccine.
Companies such as SCLP which steer clear of viral delivery systems - i.e. either injectables or nanoparticles, naked mRNA etc have the ability that the immune system will only mount a response against the target antigen, meaning that SCLP could go on and develop other vaccines which could work repeatedly in the same patient. With adenoviral transfer, this may not be the case.
Evening Bunsie,
Based purely on my understanding of the theory I would expect a better response from the SCLP Vax especially in the specific T and helper cell response as it targets the nucleo capsid protein in a more potent way than the Oxford ChAd Vax.
Having said that I did believe the Oxford version would generate some T cell response as a similar technology which I am much more familiar with does that.
So I fully believe in the possibility of Covidity having a potent effect vs Covid 19 and may offer big benefits in length of immune response and in specific population subsets.
This issue with all these Vax is the risks in progressing through the various hurdles both regulatory and commercial and that is where my caution lies with all Vax but in particular here until one funding us sorted and we get some initial results in humans
just a point ... i do not think any one would be "Injected" with live virus .. that would not replicate a natural infection ...
jsand -
Thanks for that. Well written and very convincing! Interesting to note that article was written less than a month ago and only 25,000 people at that stage had volunteered via IDaySooner.
Thanks Bermuda, here's another authoritative answer:-
https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/23/challenge-trials-live-coronavirus-speedy-covid-19-vaccine/
jsand,
I don't think there'll be a shortage of volunteers for challenge trials - over 300,000 people have already registered with 1DaySooner but they may still be a while off, here's just some of the issues:-
1) We still don't know enough to risk injecting live virus into healthy people.
2) To make it safer, the suggestion is to use a weakened form of the virus. If that's the case, how valuable will the results be? How can you be sure that the vaccine being tested would still offer protection against a more potent viral load?
3) Most likely only young adults would be allowed to take part, but that won't tell you how the vaccine performs in those who really need it ie. the elderly and vulnerable.
4) You'll still need to test any vaccine in tens of thousands of patients for safety.
So challenge trials wont replace phase III trials but they could give earlier indications of efficacy and shorten the timelines to approval. Another huge benefit would be the ability to identify vaccines that don't work at an earlier stage thereby allowing resources and funding to be redirected to those that do.
It's possible, some think even probable that they will come and there seems to be a growing body of experts pushing hard for them to start. Anything that can safely speed up the development process and reduce overall costs has to be a good thing but not sure whether we're there just yet.
Ivy,
Oxford vax, they are claiming T Cell response also
How does that compare to Covidity?
I am not up to speed on the differences.
Can you add your interpretation please
Thank you
ATB
There are only a very limited number of facilities that can carry out this type of activity in a virus isolation unit and if you take out the govt facilities like Pirbright and Porton Down I can think of only 2 in Europe.
These human challenge studies on Covid 19 will cost £2-3m so £3k per participant is good value fir money
That being the case - it'll be controversial (!) - why isn't being done wholesale already?
The payment is a reflection of time spent in a virus isolation unit rather than severity of the disease.
No reason why exposure of Covid 19 to healthy volunteers after given a Vax for eg should be a particular health threat.
Somehow I don't think Covid19 is going to be seen in the same camp as
regular old flu.
Normally offered about £3k a pop to attend flu camp
It's time for me to stick my head out of the trench on this one.
I fully expect to be flamed in response - switch your flamethrowers on now.
Has anyone in authority suggested incentives for volunteering? Is there any fundamental reason
we can't offer e.g selected prisoners, a relief on sentences if they sign up?