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So it does sound like scancell have identified 33 potential cancer targets for modi1/modi2 .... each target a potential deal both in TCR and in vaccine form .... so that is a lot of potential deals lol and a lot more moditope epitopes still to be found ...obviously we need the first one first:) but... wow!
I cant fully clearly hear everything after that but I'm sure he says identifying epitopes against 33 targets or something and Lindy goes on to say after saying BioNtech is also interested in vaccines and other companies too that there are potentially a lot more deals.... or something like that...
Crumbs, thanks very much
Cliff in Q&A yes talking about the TCRs
'It is about identifying the t cell receptors against the modi 1 epitopes so it is only modi1, being able to identify these t cell receptors is a great validator in the absence of clinical data it is a significant validator of the overall technology because if we identify these cd4 t cell receptors then that means there is a whole population of t cells that can recognise these epitopes and therefore it is much more likely they occur in patients and therefore more likely to have an effective drug'
Thanks for clearing that up Bermuda
Indeed it is. Fascinating possibilities though.Have a good day
well that decision is Scancells C7 however SCIB2 could actually target metastatic melanoma
3.1. Melanoma-associated marker expression in primary and metastatic melanoma
The NY-ESO-1 stain was negative in all the primary melanomas and positive in 58 (28.2%) of the metastatic melanomas (Table 2).
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3946994/
Ivy,
Well that's back to mousegate again lol! But actually my post to Crumbs was only around preclinical development, not sure whether Crumbs was talking about moditope the vaccine or TCR.
Inanaco, when you s0ay defined groups c0an you see scib1 used in combo with new peptides?
As Bermuda says it is about Human validation ie in the clinic or phase 1.
Crumbs,
'like a say real pre-clinical validation and not in a mouse model only....'
At the risk of resurrecting mousegate, can you explain what you mean by above? Do you mean that BioNTech will be evaluating the results alongside Scancell or something different?
Yeah but if 18 peptides all showing potency against cancer now honed to 5... if they can only do 3 in each modi I guess there is a possibility of a number of different versions of modi2 ... it is all mind-boggling lol but I am encouraged by what is coming out of this BioNtech collab ... like a say real pre-clinical validation and not in a mouse model only....Sahin's got to be impressed
Great post. Well I refer again to Vulpes, boy did they research us, five years worth and extensive due diligence. Possibilities seem endless imho
Crumbs .. not sure linking 3 peptides to the adjuvant is difficult enough ... 5 ... ?
we don't know if Homocitrulline peptides requires the more difficult "hydrophobic" to be the most effective
but again building 2 vaccines rather than 1 super complex gives the program more versatility ... combinations may come into play, but in defined group ... established in trial
Also with nano delivery, I think it is now far more realistic to imagine a patient at risk of metastatic disease who has had a tumour cut out being put on an ImmunoBody course of injections as a routine preventative measure etc
I think the idea is immunoBody is more an early stage platform and moditope latestage... but with all the research going on who knows how it will end up... it is amazing really it is hard to get over the importance of the validation these 40 epitopes identified in the BioNtech are... short of clinical data this is gold... it shows moditope effectively working using donated human blood able to direct CD4 killers to 40 cancer specific epitopes... using just 3 of moditopes possibly hundreds of potential peptides.... obviously now they will work through the 40 and hone down to a clinically viable product everyone (lindy and Sahin) are happy with... so yeah 6 months behind but at the end of that 6 months they could have a product ready to be taken forwards into the clinic!... going to be fascinating to watch it unfold.. and no wonder we are (possibly) reluctant to give any moditope IP away at this stage its potential value is well massive!
Was thinking the same thing crumbs. They said they could be used as a combo therapy so does that include scibs and mod? I would have thought so, which makes things interesting
Also... this TCR collab... 40 epitopes from just 3 modi1 peptides.... the potential considering how many moditope peptides scancell are identifying is truly- wow!
inananco...do you think that modi2 is going to be including all the 5 best peptides that they have identified? what I'm wondering is how many peptides can a modi contain to be a viable product any ideas?
Didn't CH recently say in a video that the best route to deals with major pharma is with a product which ENHANCES their own, e.g SCIB1 with Keytruda ? Avidimab looks to fall firmly into that category to me.
""" Vulpes Input may bring a sense of urgency """ on the contrary Vulpes due diligence was based on the last 12 months which is based on "getting a full understanding" .... "getting the science right" and getting the "right people involved" that was all done without Vulpes influence ... and indeed they may have a seat on the BOD but they don't have sufficient voting rights to change policy to ... "urgency" ... as that means an elevated Risk ... rather than a "cool head approach" .. If you feel the science should be pushed harder, exactly how would you achieve this ??? when so much time is eaten by regulatory requirements and getting the science written up for the patents ...
of which ""Diggles would be no help at all ""...
The thing with these glycan Mabs and avidimab is that they are going to be of great interest to a load of biotech/pharma anyone into MaBs is a potential deal plus they could attract CAR T players too which we all know is a very hot area
Any deal or deals will come when they come. I am certainly satisfied that (as Inanaco said) the Bod are being rigorous in making sure the science is the very best that can be achieved prior to any deal, rather than getting it up to the 'pretty good' stage and rushing into a deal. And unlike some companies, I expect any deal(s) will be with someone significant, and not the 'Jolly Good Pharmaceutical Research and Bicycle Repair Company of Bangalore.' That's why our trials are being conducted in the UK (and all being well America in due course) and not farmed out to 'Sergei and Oleg's Clinic' in Kazakhstan (formerly the People's Tractor Factory). There's ticking boxes, and there's doing it meticulously. With the staff and the approach Scancell have, I'm happy they are being meticulous.
That we'll have a bit of a wait before we get some sort of deal. When you see how long things take In Pharma/bio It's looking that way to me anyway. I definitely think though that the Vulpes Input may bring a sense of urgency, ie keep the move on with good decisions . AIMOO.