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The post that started this thread is really good. well worth a read.
A banker with balls, now there's a thing. JPM have balls of steel let me tell you that - rock solid. The trouble is the couldnt care less about us, the mine, the company , the board - not a jot of concern. They manage events so as to maximise fees payable to them - after that they dont care.
If this takeover goes through, and I will be voting AGAINST , then i am taking what I have left and chucking it in AA. I will get the money back eventually.
I think we can safely say demand high because Boulby proves it. They can’t get it out of the ground fast enough and AA may move the bid forward because they too know how good it is.
What is TORPS exactly...........
We give you exclusive rights to sell our product in your area/region, and if you can't we will give the rights to someone else.
Have they paid for the rights?
I see no record of payments for rights to sell.
Are there any financial penalties if they fail to sell, I see none, bar losing the deal.
So what are TORPs really worth, bar providing confidence that wholesalers will make an attempt to sell the product.
Now if the were contracted to take the product, and if they failed to sell it they are stuck with it, then a TORP would have financial value. As it would guarantee income, regardless of sales.
But, that's not what they are AFAIK, are they?
If you know different I be happy to be proved wrong?
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Totally wrong. Complete load of balls above. Obviously you don't know what TORP stand for and what that concept means. Idiot
The recent Qatar deal with Munjarat wasn't a TORP - the other deals preceeding it - TORPS - take or pay
IBAB - TORP - clue in the acronym - Take OR Pay.
Arze
Are you arguing that it is worth more??
What was a brilliant heartfelt post by Jimter has been spoiled for everyone by you know who.
Intangibles
I think you are muddling your thoughts. You are so desperate to say AAL are overpaying that you will argue anything. Simple point is they are paying 386 million minus the cash in the SXX bank that is not accounted for. Gina's lien will be paid off in the same manner it would be paid off if SXX shareholders were allowed to fund the 600 million. You will be called to testify.....
SXX, once it has spent the $600M will have accessed it's resource and the high risk construction (such that it exists - not in AA's eyes) will have been overcome. That's why it'll be able to raise debt on regular commercial terms in two years time. A genius such as you IBAB knows that full well. Arze.
The woman down the road sold her sandwich shop recently. I think she got 80K for it. The buildings did not belong to her, the chairs and counters could not have cost more than 2 to 3 K. How did she manage to make 78K? Good Faith and a going concern. It's not something that you can physically hold, but it certainly has value. For you to say that the Torps are not worth anything shows again your disingenuous nature. Would AAL even have been interested if the TORPs were not there? You can argue that the TORPS are included in the consideration, but you cannot say they are not of value and hence a company asset.
SXX does not own the ground the the mine covers it is not their asset even when they reach it they have to pay royalties to landowners or the crown if under the coastline/national waters.
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Feck right off IBAB. Now you're getting desperate. Tool
The polyhalite is not a “ liability” so should be an asset. What’s the point in digging for it if it’s not an asset?
Additionally they are goiung to have to inject circa 600m over the next year or so, and plenty more besides if the mine is to be completed.
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Another misleading post by IBAB - what a shyster.
Its 600M DOLLARS NOT POUNDS. BIG DIFFERENCE and its over the next TWO years not year or so.
And thereafter the rest of the cost ought to be raised as debt not equity.
IBAB. Liar, coward, fake, fraud. Turd.
For a comparison... a miner(opencast) that I am invested in are in discussions to be bought out. They are awaiting approval to extend the mine and are including the material in the ground as part of the value. From that I deduce that AA should do the same and bid accordingly for Sirius. Doesn’t seem so. I’m with you longtermview24.
Add to that the value of the TORPS and the resource itself, once accessed, never mind what has been actually spent to date - and AA are stealing this from under the noses of sholders and the BOD are complicit in this highway robbery, or it certainly appears that way because their on the record statements and presentations do not correlate with this asset/company being sold for 5.5p.
They need to come out of hiding and face the music.
Here comes bucky with another bunch of assumptions. Are you saying that AAL are not shrewd? They certainly can see the potential in this mine. They are paying 1 billion. No they are not. The equity costs 386 million. Ginas liens are part of the infrastructure and are not counted as she will be paid over time - if AAL decide to buy her out, do not be disingenuous and add it to the cost of the mine. What debt are you talking about? In November we had 180 million pounds (from memory) 110 million was allocated, a chunk was not and we had 50 million to fill the hole. In effect AAL are paying 336 million for it. They are getting 1.8 billion USD of work for a pittance. Even you can reach the conclusion of it being a bargain if you thought long and hard about it.......Ah, I guess it will be difficult for you to go against your paymaster. You will be called to testify......
Fantastic insight to this project. I also, being a civil engineer, have never seen the difficulty and the risk they cited as the reasons for the bond failure. Surely banks would have employed someone like you, with the knowledge, to tell them that. But it was used as one of the excuses nonetheless. AAL have now confirmed they seen no issue. They say that hope is the last thing to die, and like you, I hope there is still another twist in the tail of this stock.
Thank you young man. I’d take it as a comment on a field of cow’s & one old wise bull & one young bull....
Great Post Thankyou
Nice post Jimter. You can tell the genuine posts and posters from the shysters.
I am a 68year old man who has worked in civil engineering since 1970. Virtually all of that time has
been in the ground working in deep basements, tunnels and shafts in London and almost entirely in the Private Sector.I enjoyed my career both in the field and in management and have maintained a keen interest in projects throughout the UK and across Europe . I became very interested in the Sirius Minerals project after first reading about it some years ago and have followed its progress in the trade press and their web site purely from a technical point of view. When a major London project I was working on involving Tunneling and Deep Shaft Sinking finished several of the miners moved on to the tunnel drive on “The Potash” as they refer to it. I kept in touch with them and the reports from there have been excellent in every respect, very best of modern equipment, record breaking production, highest standards in safety and quality . It was around this time that the I was tempted by the hype to invest in the company. Up to this point I had never owned a single share in my life but had amassed a fairly substantial six figure sum pension. My own experience in the industry led me to believe the project would be a great success and a shining example of this great industrial nation and so thinking I could do more for my four children and eleven grandchildren I plunged a serious amount of my pension pot into the venture. Now I accept that there is “no fool like an old fool” and I could have taken the loss I am facing if the project had failed but this project is a glowing Technical and Financial success so far and I’m sure will end up an even bigger one in the future. The concerns about the shafts may have some small merit to the inexperienced but it is 2020 and dewatering the aquifer so that the SBR can pass through it will not be a problem. The problem is the finance about which I know very little other than we , shareholders, need a banker with balls. AA will bring nothing to this project but financial clout. The Donegal men driving the tunnel will finish it successfully the same as the have thousands of tunnels before this one which is now even easier that it’s dry. The Herrenknecht Team will sink the shafts , The Concrete Plant Will Produce The Concrete ,The Tunnel Segment Factory will make the Tunnel Linings , The Earthmovers will clear the spoil and restore the landscape . Everything else , conveyors, shaft winding gear , the processing plant at Teeside and the Polyhalyte mining equipment are nothing items in this business if you have the money to pay for them. AA are just a bunch of shrewd wealthy business people who are going to buy a super 1.2 billion going concern for a song and destroy thousands of lives. I have no view on whether CF is a crook or not but right now it wish he had taken the money at whatever rate the bonds people were asking. I hope they will see the opportunity to make big profits and get back in now AA have validated it