DDDD.L Share Chat (DDDD)

Looking at CJs Mcap ~$126M , $rev etc, reckon they paid peanuts. Could be wrong, but unlikely

Sickening stuff

yes, I agree. Small company and not much cash so most likely would pay Armistice and get everything

I really don't think so. They won't have paid much

Thanks for sharing. Hopefully something for shareholders

That may not work. This should

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.koreabiomed.com/news/articleViewAmp.html%3fidxno=20740

Korean company has bought the whole pipeline and all the patents for an undisclosed price.

Makes you sick
https://www.koreabiomed.com/news/articleViewAmp.html%3fidxno=20740

Hi, yes I got a reply from Colin within a matter of days from emailing him.

No reply to date.

Hi there,
Has anyone received any sort of reply back from our emails sent to Colin?

Carve up begins. Bacthera buys 4D’s manufacturing site in Léon

hTTps://legaldealmaker.com/baker-advises-bacthera-of-4d-pharmas-plc-site-acquisition/

wambat: Did you get a response from Colin in the end?

Big write up in IC this week. https://www.investorschronicle.co.uk/news/2023/03/15/a-4d-lesson-in-early-stage-investing/

Sent an email Colin but got no response.....

colin.lawrence@talk21.com
Email with holding and sum invested (proof helpful as no doubt the management will want to infiltrate).
245 members to date.
ALL investors should eventually be a part of this.

Thanks Porky.
I hope you also join.
The directors will know what is on these chatsites, but I can safely say that there is a good case.

I lost 50% in lloyds where there was practically zero upside (It was my early days I liked the divi idea), it's not a small company thing, it's a risk management thing. I went too far in on this, but I coupled that with ignoring the warning signs. The penultimate presentation (I think) he looked so f*cked, I actually thought about selling, but most of the damage had been done, my thought process was 'what's the point, I'd may as well leave it' 3-4 days later it was gone. The financial deals could I have forseen the damage they would cause, probably not.

Well penny shares on the AIM are always high risk per sae, penny biotech plays even more so.

What i find on the AIM is that no matter what DD you do before you invest in a company, you NEVER have all the facts. What they don't say is often more important than what they do tell us and it feels like CEOs can say what they like and not be held accountable.

Nomads are now trying to suggest that for a biotech to be seen as viable and investable it must have greater than a 12 month working capital runway ahead. This would certainly help if it was enforceable but even then there are still risks: the company taking on more cost, paying higher wages, funding being withdrawn.

In the case of 4D, the directors all had a massive pay rise before the collapse and shareholders were told the cash runway was 12 mths. So even if that was enforceable you would still get shafted.

As i see it, if you back these kinds of investments its probably worth a) as best you can ensuring they have enough capital to survive for more than a year and b) Ideally a clear route to break even of costs or ideally into profitability so they are not just reliant of SH money in the future c) only invest what you can afford to lose and d) one that works for me personally is should you double your money sell half so you are in for free. Certainly trade/take some profits money off the table when the going is good e) regularly evaluate if you would still invest today if it was presented to you as a new proposal

But yes, you are right it can be Red or black at best half the time....

The issue you have here is that the administrators obviously take a chunk of ongoing fees and there is nothing to stop Duncan either directly or Via associated companies buying up the assets from them and then selling them onto Merck or whoever further down the line. How hard have they actually tried to sell the assets?

I would hate for Duncan to profit at our expense and i fear this is the reality now. On a positive note administrators can get sued for damages if they do not secure best value for creditors including shareholders.

The stand out issues as i see it are:-
1. The fund was selling down continually, makes you wonder if they knew or had information that us private investors didn't have
2. Duncan was telling us the cash runway was 12 mths when clearly it wasn't and investors were backing him on that basis.
3. It now appears that Duncan was avoiding updating us on the Oxford Finance situation and shareholders remained under the false illusion from the RNS he put out that they had a further 30m of capital available to draw down - when in truth they were actually in breach of covenants and this wasn't likely.

Its the small private investors that get fully shafted in these situations. I would urge all shareholders reading this to contact Colin Lawrence - obviously its a slim chance of recovering anything but the action group is over 200 strong, a solicitor appointed acting for the group and its certainly worth a try.

Red or black - make your choice.

In all seriousness, we have been funding a research company that even when available in admin, no big pharma came forward with an offer.

As they usually don’t have income streams, the only way to fund these is by dilution.

Anyway a £10k lesson for me.

What happen to DDDD is a lesson for anyone believing in investing in UK so called world class ideas and AIM. It is difficult to accept that AIM regulators bothers about how UK AIM investors money are managed and used. What is also difficult to understand why DDDD ideas could be considered world class and world leading and yet no UK private funding entity and including the UK Government Research funding support system are interested. Is it that only US Hedge Funds sees the potential of DDDD. Hence may have planned the breakup of DDDD and their transfer to the US considering a big US company is involved with the work of DDDD.

If you are not willing to write off your losses in defeat:-
Wheels already set in motion.
Send email with confidential sum invested and shareholding.
colin.lawrence@talk21.com
No timewasters, no trolls, no bull**it .
Just part of the 176 -strong SAG.
Total sum invested by all members is large and growing.

Tav. yes HMRC will regard these shares as having some value until the company is completely dissolved which as you say could be months away even a year or so.
Had already written the stock off and would like to use the loss against another gain. Not sure who would want to buy a delisted share that has little or no value.
Had a similar situation with another Bio-pharma a few year ago ( I seem to be a sucker for Bio-pharma's), which was not listed. It went bust, my Accountant used the date of Insolvency to establish the loss, even though it had not fully registered with Companies House. That event was at roughly this time of year.
It will be worthwhile having conversation with my Accountant.

Fair , I have been through similar delistings before and the key issue for cgt purposes is the date At which HMRC deem the shares worthless. Imv this is months away.Until the disposal process has gone much further and the receiver s published accounts the delisted shares could in theory have value. So little chance of HMRC declaring nil value yet . Maybe you could sell your delisted shares somehow and crystallise the loss -ask an accountant would be my view.

The Administrators have delisted the Company which effectively means Shares are worthless, however until Liquidation is completed the company still exists. Have the Administrators been appointed as Liquidators?
Is the company still trading? Have Staff been dismissed?
The company will only cease to exist once a Voluntary or Compulsory Order is confirmed by the Court.
The protocols involved here could be extremely messy, Administrators should make crystal clear exactly how they are proceeding. It is likely they ( Adminsitrators) consider having delisted, ordinary shareholders have been dealt with and are of no consequence, allowing actions in Favour of Creditors( Armistice) to proceed unhindered.
Should Duncan and the BOD have made some statement?
Am raising these issues as from our point of view our investments are dead. However there are likely many of us who wish to use the loss against gains in the Current Tax year ( ends 5th April).
An application to the Court within the next month is necessary.

AIMO, but would welcome any other views that will help cheated Investors.