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You are indeed correct, but you fail to remember: Many people are mad and also ill-educated.
There are thousands that post vile things on the internet.
And your point is?
Irrelevant, to many.
Hence, why this discussion is still a waste of time and energy.
The SP has gone up by the way :)
Democracy requires an informed citizenry and becomes untenable under sufficient misinformation and disinformation.
What we have is some sort of oligarchy: plutocracy, kakistocracy, gerontocracy, or perhaps idiocracy :)
Currently the zombie horde is attacking schools and hospitals. This is not free speech, it's malevolent propaganda delivered by a small army of moronic useful idiots, somewhat akin to brownshirts.
Vaccines are probably the greatest contribution to human flourishing that medical science has ever achieved, and anti-vax is among the worst examples of the madness of crowds, or mob rule.
Have a nice day.
I say again, why dont you stick to posting some of your real positive contributions again?
You have opened a can of worms, and are in a discussion nobody will ever win.
Democracy, opinion, free speech and all that.
Too much positive energy in this share to waste it on pointless discussion.
Taking a swipe at overweight nurses.
Quite incredible. That is probably a new low well done you.
that’s classy abrooking. Time to end this thread.
Apologies - should have headed message for Woodstock
Wow, such honesty and such a shame. Sending my best wishes for a full (and hopefully speedy) recovery.
Most nurses seem to be overweight, plus they always have a supply of chocolate and cakes in their break rooms. They might be strong enough to be able to lift a fellow fatty slightly to get a patslide underneath, but generally they're a high risk category in the majority.
Err well actually obesity for example does put NHS staff at considerable risk.
Doctors, nurses, physios, paramedics, porters, radiographers etc etc are generally not powerlifters.
They increasingly have to support, move or assist twenty odd stoners who are incapacitated.
Ghia, But obesity and other self inflected comorbidities, does put staff at risk. These self inflicted comorbidities make one's immune system weaker, and more susceptible to catching covid and developing severe complications. How much could the spread have been reduced if the message had got out and people actually took responsibility for their own health during the year before vaccines came out?
Ghia, I would like the nhs to reduce the number of managers and 'chief executives and emploty more front line staff so as to provide a decent service for my children, like it did about 30 years ago at a much reduced cost,
Hants - We need to protect the NHS and those that work in it.
Obesity and all those other arguments you raised are a drain on the NHS sure but they do not put the staff at risk.
Imagine pitching up to work for over a year caring for critically ill patients who are infectious and each time you tend to them you are putting yourself in the firing line.
Imagine the mental health implications of turning machines off time and time again for those you couldn’t save.
Now imagine the situation where you are doing all of this a year further down the line but the majority of cases are preventable if they had had a vaccine. We are not talking bolstered here just a couple of jabs.
You then get to the situation we are in now a flogged NHS which is loosing sympathy and loosing numbers.
I’d like the NHS to be there for my children and to be a service we are proud of. For that to happen we have to look after it when they need us most, we all clapped and stayed safe when there was nothing better we could do to help, there is one simple thing we can do to help now.
The science for vaccines is fine but you can't keep on giving boosters. The science behind boosters was that those over 60 lose their immune response quickly but there is no science behind vaccinating children or giving boosters to young NHS staff.
We have gone crazy on vaccines thinking these are a silver bullet, can't wait for SNG to be approved so we have a decent option and only try to cure the sick rather than dosing everyone and his dog with a vaccine.
We need a way of living with Covid and if SNG does that it will be worth billions to the global economy.
Alexa, even Boris Johnson in his winter plan interview on Sky admitted vacccination does notstop you getting r passing on covid. It just reduces the severity. Kinda blows your argument out of thewater.
Well said. We need a balanced media and a balanced debate in society, both of which have gone awol since Covid arrived. David Mellor's article in the mail yesterday was appalling. The term anti vaxer is derogatory. I'm jabbed but you only have to read Gov.UK for the Yellow Card Notices to see that in the future the Government will be able to say "We did tell you of the Vaccine risks". RIP BBC presenter Lisa Shaw and the many others who had side effects. Brighty
I think the difference between someone needing care from injuring themselves by playing football, and needing care through not having vaccine is that an injury from football or similar only requires YOU to have care.
By not having vaccine, you are causing other people to potentially need care. I think that’s the line. Are you contributing to the Potential I’ll health others.
"anyone who questions the validity and efficacy of the vaccine campaign needs to be chained outside with the dogs"
What a terrible thing to say. Dogs have been our best friends for millenia.
Chaining them up outside is horrible, and forcing them to associate with anti-vaxers is even worse.
To be honest, I was starting to respond to ghias post, then thought I can’t be bothered.
My sentiments exactly!
Doc - you can ramble all you want, life is a democracy and people have the right to choose. It may not be your choice, but that doesn’t make them better or worse than you, just different.
Some families have had deaths linked to the vaccine. If they then refused the vaccine for obvious reasons, should they then be denied NHS care, which they may have paid into for 3 years?
It’s an argument nobody can win, due the words, democracy and choice.
People i know who have recently had covid are 'vaccinated'. My brother in law said he felt worse this time around than before he was jabbed. I will wait until the vaccines go though 3 phase trials.
"To anyone refusing the vaccine, you expect NHS staff to care for you when you are sick if you refuse the vaccine potentially putting their lives in danger I think they should be given the right to refuse your care."
So if somebody is obese, which puts them at an increased risk of not just covid but a multitude of other and conditions, should they be refused care?
Is somebody who is jabbed but leads an unhealthy lifestyle/obese more deserving of Covid care than somebody who really looks after themself and is not jabbed?
If a frail person who doesn't need to work, rides the bus at rush hour every day, goes into busy shops when they don't need to catches covid, should they be refused care? They could've kept themselves safe.
If somebody is playing football and injures themself, is that their own fault and they shouldn't be cared for? They're taking up capacity for somebody else who might need it, and they didn't need to be out playing football in the first place.
Many things which people end up in hospital for are a result of their actions, even if unitentional.
The problem with your arguement is - where are you drawing that line?
The vaccines aren't without risk. And we don't have long term data because they haven't existed anywhere near long enough. In the USA, 22% of drugs have black label warnings added or are completely removed from sale within 16 years for later discovered side effects. Consider that. Then consider how quickly these vaccines have been made. We could also talk about how they've been pushed through approvals to get Governemnts out of trouble, and how much money is being made from them. But that's a rabbit hole...
Many peoples counter to what I've just said will be stopping transmission, but we now know vaccines have been mis-sold and this isn't the case, contrary to the original narrative. (Infact that narrative still exists - vaccine Covid passports!). The benefit is marginal. The last study I recall reading was from University College London who put it at 4% if memory serves me correctly. IIRC they stated it should be more than this, but the changes in jabbed peoples behaviour from the sense of security undoes the small about of benefit they provide.
I'm happy for people who don't want to be vaxxed, and happy for those that do. It's for each individual to assess their own risk/reward profile. The most important thing is freedom of choice. Telling people they *should* be vaxxed and suggesting they're a bad person if they don't is totally unacceptable. Also, I notice lots of people doing that seem to be much older - so higher risk and with a shorter lifespan ahead of them should they encouter a side effect. If those 60 year olds were 20 again, their view point could be completely different.
Dock - your understanding is based on hypotheticals.
If you have done your research and think it works for you great. The small percentage that have reported on the yellow card say otherwise.
Why do the MSM not allow the scientists that have raised doubts to speak freely?
(To censor the other side of the coin is a red flag to me)
I have suffered from the same thing before I was vaccinated and still do.
Brilliant post Ghia. Kevin - you've embarrassed yourself. It has alway been a matter of life and death. People have died because of the stuff that Prof and Andy and in particular that fu.cking satanist Antofelli have been pushing. It's not a matter of perspective . There are not two arguments or multiple equally valid positions that can be dicussed. You may argue about the sway of big pharma or the corruption of governments all you like, but anyone who questions the validity and efficacy of the vaccine campaign needs to be chained outside with the dogs.
Yes, let's keep this board about SYN rather than civil liberties.
Who knows, if Synairgen's treatment works as per P2 and it plays nicely with an antiviral, vaccination may not be required in the future other than for the vulnerable.
I guess we find out around or just after Christmas.
You’ve posted some good stuff previously, although after reading your last one, which raises all sorts of concerns, maybe we all need to stick to posting about the benefits and need for therapeutics, like Synairgen.