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''I wouldn't do mining for Ā£30K either. I've no idea what they actually earn drilling underground''. IIRC, the adverts for Cononish miners were Ā£20k/annum +shift allowance.It was peanuts.
I wouldn't do mining for Ā£30K either. I've no idea what they actually earn drilling underground in Scotland, probably a fair bit more than that, maybe it's Ā£40-50K?. I was just trying to make a point that Scotgold must be paying 10X the renumeration of even a fairly renumerated (not exploited) African miner.
Scotgold boasted grades of 17g/ton if I recall....problem is this year they couldn't find the vein and exhausted their working cap... so 0g/ton at times....with no reserve in bank.
African miners have lower grades, 3 to 5 g/ton, but veins are wide and wages low, hence they have a viable business with AISC of $1000 or so. Scotgold's "super high grade" (as big Phil would say) should have made us all wealthy (or whatever)...but instead has made our shares practically worthless....
Or will a knight in shining armor appear, willing to invest the Ā£10-20M Scotgold needs to give it a chance? If they do I'd guess it's most likely to be a post administration deal cutting out existing shareholders. However I live in hope. You never know a positive RNS could be round the corner...haha?
Bismark, things have doubtless changed since my time in South Africa.
Baz, I wouldn't do mining for that pay either.
Andrew, ta for the Parkswatch link. I must agree that as time goes on, the more that comes to light, the more desperate it all became. Your postulated scenario of a micro-mine is the only idea in response to my ask, but then the process plant will likely be an oversized expense. I only hope that something comes up for employees and remaining shareholders, though I am not hopeful.
But where there's life there's hope and I have this week become a great grandfather for the third time!
Regards to all, R.
PS, Ā£30k/annum is p**s poor wages for working underground.
''I've watched numerous podcasts from Mark Learmonth of Caledonia who operate the Blanket mine ''and the Blanket is mining 4 gms/tonne,the cut off point at Cononish.
@Rockhead
"As for labour and costs, yes, much cheaper when paying peanuts to exploited migrant labour."
I've watched numerous podcasts from Mark Learmonth of Caledonia who operate the Blanket mine in Zimbabwe and ironically sold the Conoinish project to Scotgold.
Their AISC is about $1000/oz. Their drillers are not paid Ā£30K+ overtime + expenses like those in Cononish, but the company does provide accommodation, schooling and healthcare for the miners and their families, along with a competitive wage. So I wouldn't describe them as "exploited migrant labour".
Bismarck, it would be interesting to see the reconciliation of figures and match them up with the statements to see what they knew and when. Maybe administrators will do so in due course.
Bp, even if nlr spent millions to pull the company back from the brink, on top of whatās already been spent. Would he ever see it back? He hasnāt so far.
Is it even possible for this type of mine to become economical? If it is, whatās stopped it so far.
They can tell us thereās billions in the ground until the cows come home, but if they canāt extract it economically, itās useless.
I see it turning into a micro mining operation with about 10-20 staff who slowly chisel away at low cost and hopefully turn profitable. Then hopefully sell the dream again to the national park to extend the life of the mine.
Time will tell
Were the figures ever realistic or were they designed to deceive?
As for the employees getting together, I'm surprised no one has appeared on this board.
Mr Duffy's sleeping patterns - might he be anxious about a stay at His Majesty's pleasure?
I wonder what NLR is thinking at the moment. Is he spitting feathers, furious at the apparent mismanagement? Is it all part of an elaborate master plan? Will he reach into his pockets one more time? It's a pity he seems to be invisible.
I think Scotgold's stated AISC of Ā£650 was based on them reaching their full target annual production rate of circa 23,000 oz
At current sterling POG of circa Ā£1500/oz that would have given them an annual revenue of Ā£34.5m with on-mine costs of only Ā£15m.
Easy to see why people invested on those sorts of numbers. If they could have even maintained 50% of their target production they wouldn't be in the state they're in now, but they couldn't even manage that.
Disgusting. The employees should get a representative and go to the papers. By the time this is carved up, any redundancy money will be long gone.
Scotgold have made it abundantly clear that their staff will not be paid during this period of āgarden leaveā. What hasnāt been made clear is how long this will go on. This equates to the employees being ineligible to claim benefits or redundancy pay to cover their inevitable bills/rent/mortgage payments, as technically they are still employed. How does Mr Duffy sleep at night knowing the situation he has left these men and women in? Soundly, I suspect as he has been completely void of any empathy towards them thus far.
Baz I donāt think connonish ever actually met their targeted cost of extraction. I think that low cost miner rubbish was as credible as the billion pound multiple mine stories. A āwonderful taleā some might say.
Hereās an interesting read on the state of the national park and what has to be done whilst work has ceased. Looks like sgz might have to pay staff while they are off, as they should.
https://parkswatchscotland.co.uk/2023/10/06/the-collapse-of-the-cononish-goldmine-the-loch-lomond-and-trossachs-national-parks-head-is-in-a-spoil-heap/
'' As for labour and costs, yes, much cheaper when paying peanuts to exploited migrant labour.''. In South Africa today it costs approx Ā£1000/oz to produce. Connonish bragged about Ā£650/oz therefore the wages per miner are irrelevant in this case,
Quite possibly, given the now better gold price, if they achieved the number of development and stope faces required in the 2015 BFS, and did not make the mistakes of Scotgold. I doubt they will return to a rescue! Anyone any ideas on who might, or is it seemingly too late?
ATB, R.
I have no expectation any comfortable response from you, Andrew. It does not seem to be in your nature. It is easy to look back and criticize, especially since the abortive process plant start-up, but before that, the enthusiasm and commitment of the then small team at Cononish was encouraging and much was achieved IMO. Since then, errors were made and even compounded in my view.
" there's millions of tons of gold in space, does that make it geologically good too?" No, that's just being silly.
"as for south african veins, i don't think they were as contorted as this connonish vein" They are not veins, but sedimentary layers ('reefs') originally sub-horizontal, but later often tilted, some up to 60 degrees and frequently faulted over the following 2.8 billion years. As for labour and costs, yes, much cheaper when paying peanuts to exploited migrant labour.
You and I just see things differently,
Regards, R.
"Building firm boss ups Scotgold stake"
"A SCOTTISH building company boss and his wife have cemented their position as the biggest backers of Scotgold Resources, the mining company pursuing an ambitious project in Argyll, by upping their stake to 4.01%.
Graham Donaldson, described previously by Scotgold as a "real enthusiast" for the project at Cononish, now has nearly 15.8 million shares with a paper value of Ā£83,600.
The pair had declared a holding of 3.43% last month.
Mr Donaldson has been building his holding in the company, which is listed on the Australian Stock Exchange and the junior Alternative Investment Market in the UK, over the last couple of years.
The Donaldsons are Scotgold's largest investors ahead of chief executive Chris Sangster with a 2.91% holding, according to Reuters data.
In November Scotgold announced it is scaling back its planned Cononish gold mine to focus initially on extracting higher grade deposits after a fall in the price of the precious metal made it more difficult to raise development finance.
Scotgold has indicated it is now likely to seek Ā£10 million in capital to start production at the mine near Tyndrum. This is down from the Ā£25m originally proposed"
I do wonder if an established, competent and well financed mining company, like Caledonia, who sold the Cononish project to Scotgold in the first place had built a mine there themselves, would they have been able to make a success of it?
hope and faith in what exactly? what part was giving you hope? tyndrum boy? the bod? the debt? the constant raises? or perhaps the bbc?
if you call telling the truth demolishing your hope and faith, then you'll be waiting a long time for me to lie to keep you comfortable rockhead.
this "geologically good prospect" means exactly zilch if you can't extract the "geologically good" part in an economical way. there's millions of tons of gold in space, does that make it geologically good too? or would talking about the prospects of that be uncomfortable too.
you propped up the talk on here of how good things were, while it was a complete **** show. and for that, you my friend, are complicit in the losses some have experienced. i wouldn't class you as the next tb, but please cut the crap about anything to do with this being in any way good. it is disingenuous at best.
as for south african veins, i don't think they were as contorted as this connonish vein and they definitely didn't operate in the same climate with labour, fuel, tax costs etc.
I and 'cohorts' here had had hope and faith, even though mine waned earlier. It is not comfortable to stomach someone else to come along and try to demolish that, even if they in time prove correct.
Thanks for the promise of profits, but I'm not greedy as I've already had mine. I wish all here luck in getting back their money by whatever means, but hold little hope of that.
For those that remain invested or employed, it will take rather more than hope or faith. I would still like to think that Cononish will have the chance to survive and revive fortunes as I still regard it as a geologically good prospect. Despite your misgivings about 'narrow veins,' even the South African 'reefs' (sub-horizontal seams) where I once worked, were only ~0.5 to 1.5m thick.
A good weekend to all, R.
Nothing scarier than this horror show.
Happy to pay out on those odds rockhead. As soon as I get my money back from sgz, youāll be the first I send the profit too lol.
I was right though. Unfortunately. All the crap I took for months and I was right. Just a shame you and your cohorts never joined me as we could have saved a lot more people from investing.
The name Donaldson will stink out the glens for generations to come.
'Odds of rockhead admitting I was right about it heading for administration 150/1.'
Yes, Andrew, you called that one right. Odds revision needed?
Andrew giving up his fixation with TB, 200/1?
Andrew giving up his OCD on this board, 500/1?
Halloween is my 77th birthday. Odds on me making it till then, LoL?
GLA, R.
What other normal shareholder do you know who had the BOD on speed dial, or who could organise a mine tour, or who knew more than any other shareholder, or who disappeared miraculously after 14 years just before it went wrong, or who invited people looking to be recruited to contact him first, or who had gold on his mantelpiece from the mine etc etc etc.
And most importantly, who, off the back of this knowledge, pumped the stock to others then tried to delete the threads on here to hide the evidence.
The answer is, whatās going to be done about it. Stinks.
TB doesn't have to reveal himself, we all know who he is, what he does for a living and how much he paid for his ounce of Scottish gold.
We know his views on the UK, Westminster, the union, Rangers FC, proddies.....etc etc
We're really only interested in whether he dealt sgz shares with insider info, and if so, what's being done about it.
Good to have a laugh as the ship sinks prior to the obese female gendered one bumping her gums by vocalising. :o).
Odds of tb coming back 100/1
Odds of rockhead admitting I was right about it heading for administration 150/1
Odds of Scot gold extracting any gold in the guise of sgz 180/1
Odds of tb turning tricks at the tyndrum inn to raise fresh investment 5/1
Odds of Samson taking up the offer by tb in the tyndrum inn 3/1
Last but not least, who forgot to spin around when shouting in the mirror, TB reveal yourself!! three times? It will soon be halloweeen of course, and this horror show is just about to kick off
More likely an omen for the whisky brand of that name than Scotgold I still have a bottle! If anyone is not partial to whisky, B & M sell a mans spray called Goldigga for Ā£4.95!
GLA, R.