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Please explain ''our priority'' - you seems to know all the free people priority. I consider myself too stupid to workout the master plan, but you seems to know all what is right. Personally i think that You should be the priest and show people like me who need help the way of the true warrior, the real investor my mate. I can see the light, but remember the light can be coming from many sources if You consider mirrors my man.
As I've said before on here. Your right to not get vaccinated (something I agree is a valid right) should not trump someone's right to not be put in harm's way from an individual who does not take adequate safety measures.
It's reasonable to expect a business to be able to implement whatever safety measures they deem reasonable, or for the government to enact laws to enforce a minimum level of safety in spaces where people gather.
Your right to not get vaccinated should also not trump a cancer patient's right to get treated in hospital so it is also reasonable that measures are taken to reduce the number of unvaccinated people being admitted to hospital after refusing treatment.
The bottom line is: Actions have consequences and as a society we have to find the right balance of what is acceptable. People who refuse free potentially life saving treatment who put others in danger are never going to be our priority when making decisions.
I have always wondered why those who advocate freedom of speech and freedom of choice ( as I do to a large extent except where the law is broken eg slander or inciting racial hatred) think that such choices should come without consequences. When I am weighing a decision I look at the possible consequences of the various options before reaching a conclusion. In theory the law allows me to walk up to the girlfriend of a seven foot tall bloke and tell her how unattractive she is, but I probably wouldn't. I fully respect that some people choose not to be vaccinated but they have to understand that this decision will have a knock on effect on their lives whether it's 'fair' or not. I don't particularly like putting foreign substances into my body but I am aware that failure to be vaccinated may well mean being left on the margins of society as well as not being able to travel to Bosnia where I have a business. If, faced with all the negative consequences of their decision, people maintain their stance then fair play to them. I note however that on the day that the latest Austrian lock down started they had record numbers coming forward to be jabbed. If/when there is a crackdown here I imagine the same will happen.
DJ covid and flu are not the same, other than both being respiratory illnesses. Plus I'm terms of deaths and loss of life years flu in a bad year is a sixth of the impact of covid. However I agree it's complex and I don't agree that intention to aim to protect and prevent the impacts of covid should come at the cost of delaying other life critical treatments like cancer etc.
We all have areas of agreement and areas of disagreement. That's totally normal and fine. But agree this is probably not the place to discuss it and were not likely to come to a concensus or change anything by doing so, hence why I didn't reply until late on opin the debate.
I'll leave it there. Atb, have a good rest of the weekend.
The belief that it makes a difference if your vaccinated or not , you catch and pass it on regardless as proven in my own vaccinated friends who have all mostly had it.
It’s not proven that me been vaccinated helps others.
Their is an argument to suggest vaccines cause mutations just as much as they might stop them.
It’s an absolutely polarising debate.
I just work off common sense and logic.
I believe in my heart that all this is futile , I understand vaccines manage healthcare , and it’s all about delaying. But at some point we need to get the hell on and except a level of death like we do with the FLU which is exactly the same as Covid.
It’s just Covid is a new variant of FLU , once it works it’s way wave after wave humans die less , it’s nature’s design and unfortunately survival of the fittest.
It’s a case of dammed if we do and damned if we don’t and I completely respect others views.
I just know that after another year of this most will think , did we actually save anyone.
Longer term we kill more due to this course of action and ultimately our compassion costs life’s and a more unequal society.
We let tens of millions die of hunger yearly and have a cure for that yet we are self interested westerners.
Poorer countries are on their knees due to our disproportionate response to the virus.
Good to hear others views
I was supposed to not post another Covid comment haha.
DJ while I don't really think anyone will win a debate on vaccination etc. I think the point you make about being able to exercise our own right is valid, freedom of choice etc.
However, when making that decision the person needs to consider not only themselves but society and the community. Their capacity to pass it on to the more at risk cohorts, the impact to attaining herd immunity, the risk that of increased opportunity of covid spreading / mutating to something much worse. These are simply the truths of choosing not to vaccinate. So while I appreciate that an individual may choose to not vaccinate, as they are not in the high risk group, it's not that simple.
People will change their tune if they pass it to their grandparent, parent or we do get a much worse strain.
So yes an individual choice, fair enough, but there is an argument to suggest those who choose to not vaccinate and carry on regardless should be considered in a different group to those who have been vaccinated. It's not about being second class citizens, or engineered by policy makers (despite their clear belief they want as many vazed as possible). It's about the simple fact that those choices pose a higher risk as outlined above and therefore IMO they should be considered as a unique group.
What if a nurse or emergency worker decided to not get vaccinated and they passed onto your sick relative? I don't agree with a lot of the decisions the government have made in this last couple years but it's not a situation I'd want to manage, especially as we were woefully under prepared with contingency plans on how the country would function in such an event.
Anyway back to RMM. Fingers crossed for better markets next week.
Plus a large amount of people that are vaccinated are old , or immune compromised so it stands to reason your less likely to see a healthy unvaccinated person in hospital or a vaccinated person under 70.
I think we should extrapolate at least half of the initial deaths out as most were manipulated or sadly close to death anyway , their exit from this mortal coil sped up so to speak.
Let’s not forget this virus along with other coronavirus’s are designed to trim the population. We are fighting nature.
How much life force have we lost measured in years on 8 billion people. We measure mortality in years lived. What about the combined loss of life of 2 years over 8 billion.
Not worth all this suffering , it’s a rich persons self interest Covid , try been poor hand to mouth , you’d soon change your tune to a more rounded one.
Lockdown fanatics are selfish. Anyway that’s my Covid speech done , no more on it now , you get my gist !!
Ryan Covid has already killed about 0.23% of the UK population. Not 0.23% of those who have actually caught it, but 0.23% of the population. Your IFR guess is wrong.
And to whoever was saying that most of the people in hospital are vaccinated, which shows vaccinations don’t work……nobody has ever said vaccinations are 100% effective, and the % of vaccinated people in hospital just reflects the high proportion of people who have been vaccinated. When everyone has been vaccinated, every Covid patient in hospital will someone who has had the vaccine, but there will still be people in hospital with Covid because the vaccine is not, and has neve been claimed to be, 100% effective