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you can always check if you look at poster history ask y1101
eye/who was that from val days
I just checked for accuracy: KDNC*s consultancy and Founder as Advisor - 3 billion + volume of shares traded on Fri, 5 Mar 2021-top No 1 riser on London South East etc. Trades executed 4,341 and share price ended up +71.33%.
So, if, if your KDNC case is compelling and obvious to all, then, it could enjoy some of the success of old when REM first financed Sonora. People will rush in and volume and share price will follow.
That is what everyone says and whether old legacy holder from REM days, new or looking in, all will be made clear.
Do not be concerned that people ask. If new folks find a forum not friendly and one can ask and not get ...on, then, it will be a place where more people will come to and sentiment is good.
That*s what I look for. Maddog38, sorry if you were here in 2013 although REM days predate further than that? I apologise as your timeline said you joined in 2015? All the best to everyone and to you - you may have been someone else that I had not seen from the days of REM at 0.04p.
I am in school, I was a kid that asked questions and my school was one in which they encouraged independent thinking and all the kids were great. I am not used to closed discussions. One forum has lost nearly 50% of its value - again, it is closed and unfortunately no one there can do simple maths. If they could work out that 30% JV does not equate to X buyout, then they would have known etc. Hence, when a forum is CLOSED and no one can discuss, then people tend to run away as it is not seen or perceived as friendly?
News, Sat 6 Mar 2021.
I am off now. Thank you.
@EyeGuy: "At today’s prices it’s likely to be circa $3 billion from my calcs". I know tax can be taxing, but presumably this NPV is pre-tax? I would have thought (and by my estimates), it would be more like $2B? But what's a billion between friends? LoL!
news:
The NPV which is the impaired valuation from memory is what Anglo American assigned to it following the accident now almost 10 years ago. Im going from memory here but I do recall Kiran stating the un impaired valuation was circa $1 billion.
The NPV is sensitive mostly to the price you sell the metal. As I have stated, if you wish to keep the $61 price and base our calculations on that- then that's fine.
Oher companies release NPV's at different metal prices. BZT is one of them, where they have given a range of NPV's at copper prices which show how sensitive the NPV can be to the metal price.
If you wish to base the NPV calculations on todays price - then that's fine or maybe go somewhere in between. As I have stated the ore which is ready for shipping is now worth circa $240 million so it is pointless using the $61 for this as it is starting likely next few weeks. The key here will be the monies received should cover most if not all the capex needed for main mine. previously when $61 it wouldn't of course. We have to wait to fine out further down the line what % KDNC will take and what they will need to pay. That's for another day.
My opinion is Kiran should release more figures based on an increased metal price if folks want to see it.
@EyeGuy
All far as I can see, I see no negativity here of the normal sort. That, in general ended when the Twitter group ie people posting on #kdnc thread bought into KDNC at 5p. It is healthy to ask a few questions and that it is NOT merely an ECHO chamber wherein everyone has only 1 view or are too frightened to voice any thing different to the main group. Mr James and everyone else has voiced their view on the matter that I asked. I do NOT post on this forum as its up to people to decide and do research or due diligence.
If one*s investment case can PASS muster, then everyone will also have that same idea of potential VALUE and share price may or may not follow.
However, if OTHERS are not allowed to ask, then it means that the investment case is not compelling.
Yesterday, the share price of the NO1 top riser was XYZ share and at one stage up nearly 60%+ if not more given it was changing so fast it was hard to keep up. It went from 0.1p to 0.13p at one stage. It is a former co that KDNC was helping out and one in which the Founder was advisor to.
No one produced reams of forecasts or to and fro etc. The perceived value case was CLEAR to all. Share trades were into the XYZ. An RNS came out which was helpful to lend to what was posted.
Yes, by all means contact Kiran Mozaria or ping him. I cant ping him as I am not in touch with him or have his number etc.
Yes, if it is on headed paper from KDNC, do post the screen shot on Twitter with the potential NPV to be circa $3 billion in your opinion vs Kiran Mozaria*s latest interview on their Twitter stating Amapa $600m and Mr Alan Green saying that a recent VALUATION has been done on Amapa.
Personally, I have never been interested in iron ore as REM was about lithium. So, iron ore was brought in maybe from all the XYZ since the losses historically of folks?
Thank you. I look forward to your NPV from KDNC on noted paper or if I want I usually OPENLY tweet KDNC on Twitter eg lithium project in Australia [KDNC] of which Mr Mozaria has now kindly eluciated on.
Pardon me if this is my last post as I do not want to spend my life on this KDNC forum only.
Thank you.
News, Sat 6 Mar 2021.
DYOR.
sorry l am wrong 2013
news l was only joking " and as for rem days you are wrong l have holding since 2014 i.e rem days any one will tell you .
News - I think everyone should do their own research.
Not all posters on here are what they seem.
Maybe they are and just scared to death of the shares going up lol.
I recognise one in particular from VAL bb. He plagued that with negativity even at 3.5p about a year ago. The shares went up almost 20 fold and then he disappeared. Strange that.
I’ll ping an email to kiran regarding the NPV’s of the main mine at different spot prices so everyone can see themselves.
At today’s prices it’s likely to be circa $3 billion from my calcs
no/maddog38
Its not old stuff. I have never been able to keep up on this forum.
I do not get all the horse racing stuff and pages and pages or reams of posting to find out.
I was posting on the other side about KDNC lithium, NT, Australia and merely mentioned EBITDA etc before it ran into to and fro. It could NOT be settled as there was insistence. Hence, why I came over to do a CURRENT POLL of what folks think and decide?
maddog38- you have been posting for a while now but not from REM days. You yourself have said X or Y which does question some of the more exuberant no and take a grounded view and I am therefore allowed to do so as well but that was not ok on the other side?
So, I came to ask - I cant go through posts from Jan 2021 when this discussion started.
Personally, I do not really care what it is technically as I am waiting for an KDNC RNS ie shipping has started "TECHNICALLY" per Court [per cause17] and AGREEMENT SIGNED ie KDNC.
No one can force another to accept NO AGREEMENT, SHARE PRICE FORECAST £5-10 FOR KDNC etc. That was what was happening on the other side.
I have asked and everyone has been kind to reply with GREAT THANKS.
Matter now closed.
I wont be TRYING to JUMP INTO KDNC SHARES FURTHER by buying more just because there is sightings of the ship etc. I will wait for the RNS.
Even cause17 has pre-fixed with "technically" Dev can ship and AGREEEMENT may be signed before or NEAR SHIPPING - that is FINE.
No harm finding out and asking everyone.
I do not post here so I am on topic re KDNC.
A bit of legal difference here-TECHNICALLY CAN SHIP $10m as profit. I was asking about the whole SHIPMENT? So quite a different QUESTION ALTOGETHER.
I had no choice but to ask everyone here as it was going to and fro over the other side.
To me, I just wait for the KDNC RNS like everyone should - if others WANT TO JUMP on posts, up to them.
Thank maddogo ask38 with due respect.
Sat, 6 mar 2021
Nothing more to ask. Thank you. I wont answer as to many to and fro.
EACH TO THEIR OWN THINKING AS ITS ONE*S OWN MONEY AND DO WHAT ONE THINKS AFTER DUE DILIGENCE OR NOT.
@news: It is very nice to see you post here. I found your posts a few weeks back on the .pl forumn very informative. Thank you.
Below was the update from courts.
04/03/2021 Documento
Protocolo nº WPRO.2100203050-1 Embargos de Declaração Cível
04/03/2021 Subprocesso Cadastrado
Seq.: 50 - Embargos de Declaração Cível
https://esaj.tjsp.jus.br/cposg/search.do?conversationId=&paginaConsulta=1&cbPesquisa=NUMPROC&numeroDigitoAnoUnificado=2199480-27.2020&foroNumeroUnificado=0000&dePesquisaNuUnificado=2199480-27.2020.8.26.0000&dePesquisaNuUnificado=UNIFICADO&dePesquisa=&tipoNuProcesso=UNIFICADO&uuidCaptcha=sajcaptcha_a4b0de256b784799ae59ab0ee174ec3d&g-recaptcha-response=03AGdBq27_wnYt1AKzEKeWS8HE9KT2CQ8xH7Yo7GKrN8gxAOaIAwEn1AkJ0-iYCZGJA7Hl7C9yXgCrAiA6vPCZ1yDfEtuyz1IamdQdg7EIAHi1mGXln7WYSLObM-kevYYSxwvgmZq5F73iSjpkS7E7Hln1pinuvNySFIfxWRj3xY62M5jbuNtlnKTNJtv1QYsOm8rZrdpiT09cmMgrM3xalSCmGv1cUg-UUwTb6U99Ihbzimhh1_G6g7WEO8OEhSdgv_2z3ttWjzyYQ57kf6KQs8KuUT_4KtxW6zkP0Hpg58rngMmXsradfgy1PC_FFJHayA-DwhRRUb31BtmJGXtQI6_HH100lXv03PiM9ORFFOK8O37NnbzWDgr632j-xjm3N3Ubx4teBG3o8wkU6zIHGuJyEHHR4uXuJMhRXbN_PB-rDl2AvQZLmzDfdqmkZ7DznRfOYZTIbBtzHNM44BMpfFCMFDFwnJMsMw
Below is the apparent translation as per a Google search (not translation)
Portuguese term or phrase: Embargo de Declaração
English translation: appeal requesting clarification of the decision
news / it this your full time job posting pages of old stuff lol
@Dallasdaz
OK, you take the other side of the view which is fine, thanks vs some of us.
@Cause17-Yes, I am fine with monies paid into judicial account which is norm since there has been a Court ruling and this follows as such. TECHNICALLY DEV CAN SHIP- I am OK with that about technically with caveat "technically."
"Until the agreement is SIGNED, KDNC DOESNT OWN ANY OF DEV."- Cause17 11:22am, Sat, 6 Mar 2021. ---I AM OF THAT OPINION ALSO, SO THAT*S FINE.
SHIPPING
Near shipping date , the AGREEMENT could be signed [CLOSE OR BEFORE]. There has been an update on 4 Mar 2021 Intesa vs Dev. By the time, shipping occurs it could be KDNC JV "BUT THIS IS JUST A POSSIBILITY FOR NOW, I GUESS"@per Cause17 . The earlier part is para-phrased.
Yes, I am fine with that ie if the AGREEMENT IS INDEED SIGNED, BEFORE OR ON SHIPPING DATE, IT COULD BE KDNC JV - A POSSIBILITY FOR NOW, I GUESS---MY VIEW ALSO IE AGREEMENT SIGNED, THEN YEAH OTHERWISE I PERSONALLY WILL WANT TO WAIT FOR AN RNS FROM KDNC.
4 MAR 2021 UPDATE OF INTESA VS DEV
I have not seen what it says. So, I was not aware of this particular update.
Fine with all that as that would FALL IN with legal procedural norms.
If, it is NOT SIGNED, then there will have to be other avenues to uphold the Court ruling or not.
That also I will wait for KDNC GUIDANCE as Kiran Mozaria, CEO is helpful in this via RNS.
So, yeah, each to their own, what they want to do but for me I WILL NOT BE DRAWING OUT MY LIFE SAVINGS TO SINK INTO KDNC SHARES FURTHER no matter what the forecast are at this MOMENT whether observer842 forearms of £5-£10, latter is £1.4 billion - current KDNC 19p at £28m mkt cap region.
Thank you all. Rec. Everyone to do their own due diligence and do what is right in one*s own view. That was my point on the other side.
Sat, 6 Mar 2021 @12:20 noonish
Pardon typos.
@news - I am with @Isb and @Bannor. Technically Dev can ship. The full net amount from shipping is to be paid into a judicial account. Expenses are accounted for in the way suggested by JA and spent according to the court ruling.
Until the agreement is signed, KDNC doesn't own any of Dev.
But indications being given are that the agreement with banks may get signed before or close after shipping. There has been an update on the records with regards to Intesa Vs Dev case dated 4th. So by the time the shipping occurs, it could be KDNC joint venture that is shipping the ore. But all this is just a possibility for now I guess.
@News..your question @09:07
"EyeGuy tells me that SHIPPING can start without the FINAL SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT SIGNED? From my perception, if there is no final settlement agreement signed, then shipping of the Amapa iron ore STOCKPILE CANNOT START?
Logic and reason 101?"
Basically the interview states that DEV will begin shipping the agreed amount of material and start reinvesting it into the asset ...whether KDNC have reached agreement with the banks or not.
Dallasdaz
What does Kiran Mozaria say via the link you gave presumably of the latest interview posted on KDNC Twitter.
I have listened to it and I did not catch what you are trying to convey?
I have to top up my wifi and hence I cant listen to it yet?
Sat, 6 Mar 2021.
I did not hear Kiran Mozaria, CEO, KDNC say that we will be shipping?
KM lays it out on the 24/0/21...Time from 13:43.
https://vimeo.com/514243011
isb1974 & Bannor
isb1974
Thank you for your kind reply. Rec. @Sat, 6 Mar 2021
That is my view on the other side but two people dont agree and because the to and fro has gone on till almost mid-night, I have decided to bring it to the main forum. As you say, the share price shows no one is jumping and counting their chickens yet as the phase goes. I am of the same conservative camp.
Bannor @10:01, Sat, 6 Mar 2021
Thank you for your view. I am of the same opinion. Rec.
On the other side, one said it is "false" and KDNC can start shipping but no RNS to say from KDNC we will ship on X date. So, everyone taking the conservative view instead of jumping and putting more life savings at risk. Wise I say. I also said one can ask Kiran Mozaria but the two of them have not yet agreed to this? Needs checking and not just views of what one thinks of the interpretation etc only?
News, 6 Mar 2021.
KM lays it out on the 24/0/21...Time from 13:43.
https://www.***************************/cadence-minerals-crystallising-value-for-shareholders-interview/412963398
dev’s first ship is due to arrive at the anchorage on 30th march... berthing the same day... sailing... fully laden with ~50,000t iron ore... on 4th april... if that helps with how imminent start shipping the stockpiles is...
Yep sorry my bad - $10M
..... in fact other than it's $10M not £10M ..... what ISB said :-))
...... to be clear KDNC cannot ship anything.... DEV have been authorised to do so by the courts because the JRP process has not progressed because there has been no settlement agreement formalised between the Banks & the JV partners (Indo/KDNC) .... at this time we still own nothing of Amapa.
News,
Dev can start shipping the iron ore upto £10m, however there is no confirmed date yet for shipping.
Until the agreement is signed KDNC have nothing - when it’s signed they will own 20% of Amapa as part of a joint venture which will own 99% of Dev.
Until that is done no more than £10m can be shipped, however none of that £10m will benefit KDNC unless the agreement is signed before that ore is shipped.
As for all the calculations, I prefer to wait for the agreement to be signed and the release of the scoping study which will value it rather than believe anyone on this board or Twitter.
However there is no denying that the increase in ore prices will only be in our favour should the above happen- but what’s the point in dreaming about valuations when they haven’t even signed the agreement.
I imagine the SP hasn’t risen any further because there is still doubt as to whether KDNC will get anything out of this given their past performance over the last 6 years.
The wait goes on and on ....
yes... that’s correct... no official date confirmed yet... but we can see that dev have already booked the next two available berths at santana public port... the certainty of which will become more clear as we get closer to the arrival dates... and confirmation of the name of the vessels that have been contracted to do the shipments...