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Well I forgot about you-the type who doesn’t care what’s left behind :-)
In all seriousness it’s a crisis unfolding in my opinion but I also know there’s very little you or I can or will do about it. But overtime the mood will change, in fact it is already. We old fuds don’t like change and we like what we like and we won’t cut our ways, but it shouldn’t mean we can’t help and support the young who have no such needs (yet) do things differently. After all it’s their planet not ours.
Wellwell,
I've waited 'til after-hours to argue with you about the OT subject ! :-)
" Greta is trying to make a point for the planet. The fact she's made it so well has upset those who don't believe or fully subscribe in climate change. As well as the usual idiots."
I think you've missed out a category here, which I personally fit into. Because I don't consider myself an idiot, and I'd certainly be on e if I didn't believe in climate change. As to 'subscribing' to climate change, that's a rather odd concept. I mean, I don't 'subscribe' to climate change in the same way as I subscribe to my online copy of the Times. Make a payment and it drops into my email inbox every day. Climate change isn't something I pay for, and I'd have sent it back with a note of disgust during a couple of days of the recent heatwave.
But if you believe in the anthropogenic causes of climate change (on which subject I remain definitely sitting on the fence, sucking on a blade of grass), maybe I do pay for climate change. Through buying the diesel which fuels my car.
But when I gas up on my way to go play poker at Chatelaillon, I'm not filled with pangs of remorse and guilt that by doing so it may increase the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere. If CO2 emissions made me feel guilty, I might as well stop breathing pdq.
No, you've missed out a category of person, a category who are utterly disinterested in what Ms Thumsuck has to say or do, though acknowledging her celebrity status as another weird social phenomenon. And that is the category who are aware that climate change is happening, but SIMPLY DON'T CARE! And I'm one. OK, Chicken Little is running around saying the sky is falling, and maybe it is. But SO WHAT? I'm more concerned about the steady ongoing fall in the Hurricane SP, thanks very much.
I'm not completely thick between the ears, though, and I do believe in things like the 'butterfly effect', the laws of unexpected consequences, and so on. But as a result am quite prepared to accept that my driving to the casino may somehow provoke a volcano to erupt off Sumatra, or somewhere like that. An volcanos are enormous contributors to climate-change, much more than my car's exhaust emissions.
On which subject (exhaust emissions), a few years ago I took out my spanners and fitted a device which 'neutralised' the EGR valve on my rangerover, which has the 3 litre BMW straight six diesel fitted. The EGR is a so-called 'environmental' device, but one which would make any halfway decent engineer have nightmares. Result (proved by emissions controls taken at the two-yearly test) ? The car runs cleaner, plus I get better mileage!
Hi Foresight22,
What part of "...'supply is finite/falling, ABSENT ONGOING E AND P..." did you not see. ?
Shoulda gone to Specsavers !
ATB
W e all seem to forget that Laura Dekker sailed around the world solo years ago in a small sailboat while 15/16 years old. Young people are extremely capable and don't don't necessarily get sea sick. And don't forget the 16 year old boy who sailed the Atlantic many years ago.
Thornburg's bigger challenge will be the wall of resistance when she gets to the US.
She's actually a timely warning to us dyed in the wool oldies who, like everyone else, had never thought of global warming in the 1970s
She has her father with her and I hope the exploiters will not damage her enthusiasm, health and life for their own over exaggerated claims.
We will still need oil for many, many more years,, there may be a temporary blip in support of this company but time will bring us back on course.
Electric cars are not the ultimate answer due to the increased infrastructure, high carbon emissions due to bettery construction and further mining for rare elements. however I'm encourage by the range of adanced hydrogen driven projects from motorcycles through ships to steel production.
Good point extrader, need to wait for the graphene revolution to lighten the load. In the meantime could always consider balloons, after all plenty of hot air on this BB and spare ballast to offload as well. Eh, what, nnnooooooooo didn't mean meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
'supply is finite/falling, absent ongoing E and P'
..that is not right at all! global supply increasing eg Guyana (no oil production today) will 'soon' be producing more than UK North Sea; big discoveries in Eastern Mediterranean; massive new Shale Oil in Argentina ... global oil resources are abundant! ie not finite in our life time nor 'falling'
Hi ww /AquaeSulis01,
The space for a drinks trolley is presumably an issue because
…"On a per weight basis, jet fuel gives around 43 times more energy than an equivalent battery "
and …"It (the e-plane) has a range of AROUND 81 miles".
And people fret about 'range anxiety' in an EV on the ground....
Don't turn the heater on, sir.
ATB
LOL, know what you mean
No room for a drinks trolley so it's a no from me.
https://www.freshbusinessthinking.com/oil-and-gas-industry-listening-to-greta-thurnberg/
I have just the aircraft for you Wellwell
https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/15/20806776/norway-electric-plane-battery-crash-fjord-jet-fuel-avinor
I'm sticking to NO kids, eating less meat, cycling as much as I can... and changing my diesel car (sob...sob...I love it though!) sometime next year for a green(er) alternative.
I’m sticking to two kids, eating less meat but still flying on holiday.
Hi foresight 22,
Einstein is supposed to have declared compound interest as the 8th natural wonder of the world.
You're right to point to the Compound Natural Depletion Rate (= the rate at which - left unattended/uncorrected - oilfield production declines NATURALLY) of 3-4% a year. Fields producing , collectively, 100mbbl/day today will produce only 96 or 97 mbbl in 2020....
So, even supposing oil demand were to drop by your postulated 2 % p.a. (which some might challenge), the supply/demand dynamic is unlikely to change materially, as I understand it.
Macro-economics may affect short term, but nderlying demand seems pretty baked in........and supply is finite/falling, absent ongoing E and P.
ATB
Many people support the need for action on climate change, including me, BUT what action is the question and in what timescale?
My view is that in the rush to do something we will likely do the wrong thing for the long term benefit, such as when we rushed to diesel and now rushing to electric cars (as if that is the ultimate solution, a no brainer!). So Greta says listen to climate change scientists, but what I want is for people/politicians to listen to the scientists/technologists of solutions and put billions into their research programmes, that is where the big money should be going, not just into more electric charging points.....we might find in a few years that hydrogen or something else is the solution (for cars). There are many angles to this climate change problem and not all based on reduction in fossil fuels, from population control to veggie burgers to stem cell grown meat, etc.
In the mean time I still firmly believe that there is a strong future for homegrown oil and HUR, given all the ongoing geopolitics.
...not easy seeing oil demand - supply trends at peak. Do remember peak is 100 million BO every day! That is a lot of oil, mature fields decline at 3-7% per year so still need significant new developments to just maintain current production. What has changed in oil market is that $80-100/BO is very unlikely and >$100/BO is extremely unlikely. So price fluctuations are present indicating oil industry needs to get on as 5-10 years from now new development will be hard to sanction unless politically driven or to meet local needs. The latter will still mean good work for many! even if oil demand drops by 2% per year which would be a dramatic new era for everyone.
There is no real sign of the annual increase in Oil consumption changing. When plotted on a graph and trended, demand is increasing at pretty much the same upward rate that it has since 1950. I keep looking for signs of a consumption plateau but don't see any sign yet of one developing. It is no different for Gas where the trend also continues upwards. Coal consumption though may have peaked and now be declining, although we need a few years more data to confirm. Some of the doom mongering discussion anbout the future of the Oil & Gas Industry is being overplayed for now, but it will happen one day.
I'd get on the Titanic if it meant I could spend 5 minutes with my daughter - good luck to her and her dad. I have been wondering for a while now whether , for Hur, this is any sort of problem. Once they start to reduce oil demand then some companies are going to stop producing and that restricts the oil flow - at the end - easy to produce and refine oil may be at a premium - if a country has access to it prevents them operating in a ransom situation (How would Putin aim to use that sort of situation?) . My point is Hur and WoS may be producing right up to the end and may command quite a premium by then. It seems to be almost a patriotic duty to support and of course be supported by Hur. One job I used to do was overtaken by all sorts of developments that apparently made my skills redundant until of course the legacy stuff on which even the new stuff was built needed to be kept running - £37.50 and hour and that was a long time ago - sometimes £100+ an hour if specific knowledge required , and the country was a bit dangerous. Our lifestyles are built on oil perhaps something similar will happen.
Tantalum / Adoubleuk,
Reading back through your replies and comments, it feels like we're all on the same page but simply interpreting one passage of the text differently... it's starting to feel like a Brexit conversation all over again....
Adoubleuk: As for "Boris" aspergers? Surely not! ;-)
So must the young now wait until they are 18 or older or something before being allowed to express themselves? Probably a good idea if it avoids the disparage aimed at her.
Whilst some may characterise people with Asperger's as being 'at risk' the reality is they are often the opposite and, as I suspect is the case with Greta, are of above normal intelligence. They just interpret things differently, often without the same level of emotion or empathy those without Asperger possess.
Greta is young yes but I think that's one of the reasons she should be heard as she's unburdened and untainted by external pressures that motivate (politicians for example) some to may a point for their own gain. Greta is trying to make a point for the planet. The fact she's made it so well has upset those who don't believe or fully subscribe in climate change. As well as the usual idiots.
Tarantula - Excellent post!
You put my thoughts into a superb precis. I'm glad someone had the ability to create and post it.
Of course, not all will agree, but they don't count! Ha ha !
I find that a situation where a psychologically dysfunctional immature individual is picking on more well balanced experienced individuals more than distasteful. I see a media choosing a young ' innocent individual using her perceived purity for their own ends. I see parents using any opportunity to elevate their offspring into the limelight and I see an individual exploited for her identity to further the goals of the fascist greenies.
I have much personal experience of autism and aspergers, I was also writing letters of concern for the environment to the hen PM in the 1970's.
I strongly disagree with Yorkshire life in his assertion that we must be nice to the little angel. That is exactly her reason d'etre. An innocent face beyond rebuke.
I do however agree entirely that the core problem is too many people. All other considerations are consequences of too many people and are at best not addressing the root cause. Co2 is just a sideshow.
As one of the most highly populated countries in the world ( density ) it seems the UK is at the sharp end of human destruction.
The planet will survive. Civilisation is what's at risk.
Yorkshirelife,
No! I'm not picking on you! But your sparse posts contain a lot.
" At 16 with aspergers... she could still teach most politicians a thing or two ."
The new UK Prime Minister displays many of the symptoms related to Asperger's.... Or has nobody noticed that?
Yorkshirelife,
My apologies. I've just finished my habitual online game in 4th place (ie in the money) but am still wide awake. So another bit from your post.
"increased global human population! Cure that and you "start" to heal the planet... "
Nonono. There's nothing wrong with the planet.
When the comet or meteor which wiped out the dinosaurs hit, the planet (let's call her Ms Gaia) maybe said 'Ouch!' (assuming she's sentient), but carried on her giddy way orbiting around her friendly sun, probably completely unaware that various microscopic parasites on her skin had been obliterated.
When Pangea, the old mega-continent split apart due to tectonic movement, what was that? Just a 'facial'. Hey! The uplift of the Alps, Pyrenees, and the Himalayas due to further 'facelifts' are just a few wrinkles appearing on her friendly face.
Of course, Greta Thumsuck is way too young to know anything about the Gai Hypothesis, it's not taught in many schools, and... she chose to skip school to pursue a celebrity career with the connivance of her parents, anyway.
As someone once said, "it's tough to make predictions, especially about the future" (AIM-investors take note).
Same as it's unlucky to be superstitious.
JayKay,
"Anyway, not a debate to be had on here... Another offload!!!!!"
I agree with you there. I waited until well after the bell before blowing off steam on this O/T 'saving the planet' topic. But I had to, because if there's anything worse than waking up, logging in here, and seeing a red SP, it's reading garbage here about 'saving the planet'.
I have spent most of my life working in oilwell drilling, taking risks (sometimes at risk of my own life) in order to provide people with the most energy-efficient power-source to the world (though I didn't think of things in those terms on a day-to-day basis while having fun on the rigfloor), and I drive a beaten-up old diesel-powered rangerover and am proud of such things.
The tree-huggers just get up my nose bigtime, and I don't mind admitting that. For the simple reason that the placard-wavers are as thick as a plank of wood, and have no real understanding of how things work right now, let alone a workable solution to the problems which actually do exist.
One may fairly safely assume that anyone posting here is doing so on a computer, and it's taken a lot of hydrocarbon-burning machines to mine the minerals the thing's made of, power the factories they're made in, produce the plastic the casing's made of, and so on.
In case it's escaped anyone's attention, today is the 50th anniversary of the Woodstock Festival. The high point of the hippies! Some of whom, later, in the aftermath of Altamont, headed for the hills. And advocated a different way of life: wind-power, solar, and so on.
And nothing wrong with that. I myself have a copy of the Whole Earth Catalog still on my shelves, plus the 'Epilog', and so on. But the whole thing is, idealism doesn't provide many calories to a person.
Equally, though, I know how to kill a rabbit painlessly (I think), skin and gut it and make a nice meal. And I bet Greta Thumsuck doesn't.
This is a BB abould an oil company share, goddammit. I hope when I wake up tomorrow I won't be reading any more posts defending something entirely against all investments in such a company. Instead, as to how this SP is below 40, something I never thought I'd see again.