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CFAN, – I found this (and like this line: 'In all cases, the normal value of your company’s share capital must be below the minimum for a PLC – currently, this is £50,000'):
'Last updated: 6 Apr 2021
Section 97 through 101 of the Companies Act 2006 allows for companies to change their legal status from a UK public limited company (PLC) to a private limited company (LTD) in one of three ways:
Passing a special resolution of the shareholders
Obtaining a court order to reduce the capital of your company
Or following a cancellation or re-denomination of shares resulting in a reduction of issued share capital below the minimum for a PLC.
These processes are collectively known as ‘re-registration’. In all cases, the normal value of your company’s share capital must be below the minimum for a PLC – currently, this is £50,000, or the equivalent in Euros.'
Personally, I do discount (more or less) them taking part in a raise / dilution till they are doing a lot better than they are currently doing, so doing it from a position of greater strength. A placing would fail at the moment (imo) and they just need to make the best of the cash they have, which they do seem to be managing.
Taking eve private has been mentioned a few times lately. I may be wrong but I thought you needed a special resolution (75%) to delist. I think eve has quite a large number of individual investors which would not necessarily back this. Personally I'm more concerned that we get to a point where eve need to raise additional cash in the next 2-3 years and we get diluted further (but hopefully this won't happen...).
Been a bit of strange week for me in terms of results. Eve's results were obviously a bit dissapointing but not really too different to what we expected (I don't think earlier trading updates had implied that it would be profitable). As a result I was more dissapointed (but not surprised) with how the share price moved.
Also had results for Everyman Media yesterday (sorry to bring up a different company). Expectations in November were for a full year EBITDA of ~£7m and final results showed £8.3m. The share price has barely moved!
I just don't understand!
Cheers wyn, there've certainly been better weeks!
I can think of half a dozen sure-fire stocks that have come unstuck in the last few months. As soon as people say things are "nailed on" or announce which car they'll buy, we should SELL. Seriously, as a strategy, that would have worked on AVCT and HE1, TILS, ADV...
Anyway, there is still life in them all so let's see where the story ends.
Enjoy your weekend :)
What a ****ty week eh? :0((
I don't know how much small Pi's drive the EVE SP. I normally work on the basis that the few big percentage holders move the price and PI's don't affect it, but its such a small cap company so maybe?
I think its tough on such a small company for the MM's to keep an orderly market and we have seen how quickly the SP can rise on a rumour, so who knows, it sounds to me as though you are a major shareholder in your own right!
You know my views on CEO's statements, i'm not a fan and I am not as confident as you thats its " undoubtedly, in-disputably 'heading in the right direction'"
It just seems too hard to generate sales and therefore profits.
EVE is getting to be a household name but where is the sales growth to go along with the brand recognition?
It just seems to me that they want to be a premium brand in a mass market and thats a hard trick to pull off.
I can't see where their USP is against all the other Bed in a box competitors. So how do you charge a premium for the same thing?
I am just struggling to see where the turnaround is because the current trajectory is not good enough, which is muddling along at best.
So that leaves major cost cutting and whats left to do down that road?
Long slog ahead at best.....(imo dyor etc etc)
Wyn, do you think that the market is better than 'us' in eve's case? I can see it elsewhere but when it comes to trades on eve *WE* do seem to be the market! Even on results days, and the day before, there were only a couple of hundred trades and most of them seemed to be people here :) Three were me.
The chart know about "break-even in UK / Eire in 2022" etc. and it will be people getting bored – us – that drives the price lower if it happens. I think that people here are generally more positive on those results than they were 18 months ago. We are certainly, undoubtedly, in-disputably 'heading in the right direction' though there certainly is an argument about when we will *arrive* and in what fashion..
If they take it private we'll all be screw*d I'd imagine.
Can they do that?
its not great unfortunately but the chart has to go back about 18 months to get a read, and that's a long time for the chart.
Its just below a support of 2.5p currently but so close to it that I would not read too much of it "breaking" this line yet. But this is the big problem with EVE and TA, the spread is so large that if I waited for instance to sell if it fell to 2.35p it might well be a selling price of 2p and that is far to far away from a confirmed break down.
So I can read the chart in theorectical way but I could not act on it due to the spread.
If it stays or falls ever so slightly from here (2.45p) then the next support is 1.5p-1.7p
The march update will only confirm what this update said, except it will add "sales are holding up or improving over the last 6 weeks" or "declining"
My guess is it will be yet another "steady as she goes".....
apart from a TO (and there is no evidence at all that one is or might come), then I can't see explosive growth coming to quickly propel the SP. It hasn't in the last 2 years, so I don't see why the next 2 will be any different.
That means any hiccup in revenue might have a disproportionate effect on the SP.
It just looks like a slow grind and if no TO does materialise then taking the company private again must be on the cards to save money?
'looking more likely that we may well see sub 2 (circa 1.8) to bottom out before eventual recovery.'
The sp hasn't been that low since before covid and the boost to eve. Given that the covid-boost continues, and we are in a much better place generally, I find sub-2 hard to imagine. I won't say never as then you'll be wishing to be right which is not good! Just that I would be more than surprised.
Also, March update is not that far away so less time for investors to get bored compared to, say, the long summer.
TP reviews numbers for this month have already overtaken January 2021. Could be that more people are driven to complain than congratulate (so could be a contra-indicator of success) but we do know from the presentation that for 5 poor deliveries there are 95 good ones, and that's as bad as it has got.
Appreciated Yanis, I’m glad you’ve taken my post well and dare I say it (thinking of numerous other boards) like a fair and reasonable adult. It wasn’t, as mentioned in my post, aimed specifically at you, not forgetting that I posted in good will.
I genuinely had to go earlier, hence cutting short of my thoughts....
Oh jeez.... a new day and I see I never posted the above comment but still want to... so, voila ;)
And now to continue what I was in the middle of...lolol
As to how I see the sp going forward... results are out...done for now unless anything additional comes around, we’re (anyone out there with Eve being of interest) probably digesting, weighing up pros and cons, one’s own thesis on Eve’s outlook and to calculate do I or don’t I.... :))
With this in mind....it’s probably going to work more-so, along TA now, timing, charts and graphs, trends...... and to be pretty blunt....it’s not looking favourable at all at present on the longer time frames.
As previously suggested, about where I see the so going.... I’ve pretty much been spot on and this is looking more and more likely that we will revisit 2.2 and it’s looking more likely that we may well see sub 2 (circa 1.8) to bottom out before eventual recovery.
I will be intrigued as to what you, Wyn and others that like to play about with TA/charts, are “seeing” ahead.
I say and share all of this with you, purely as constructive and to benefit all of us.
I mentioned previously the odd occasion that Eve sp looked like it was going to take this path. Aside the small upside bump pre TU of which, as mentioned I missed out on, due to whatever.... the path I suggested it’s pretty much followed.
Sometimes on the charts side, as odd as it might sound, it’s almost as though the path needs to be fulfilled before it can refresh. Double tops, bottoms, new highs/ lows with a swift reversal...when broken down there’s a lot that can be deciphered and explained as to why.
That said and done.... not, obviously, any guarantees on that.
None of the above is meant patronise....all meant in good terms and healthy to have varying views. I do believe there is a future with Eve but there are still some long play plans to improve, hence still holding out to make it worth while.
Just imagine getting in at say 2.3.... only needs to return back to 4.6 for double bubble, 6.9 in time for a triple treat. For those to average down, you may well be able double up, for example, for less than you bought in and will heavily drop your average. Ok, admittedly, some may be obvious to some so I’m gonna schtum now.
Gl all as ever in however you decide to pursue your ventures
Yes Yanis I feel quite let down by believing in what EVE put out too.
Still utterly disappointed in CC & co.
If it was football and the results yesterday well ...........
Usernamebut, thank you. Good post.
I suppose my anger now comes from having believed them last year when they said convincingly that they will reach sustainable profitability this year and without a raise. Ofcourse now we need a telescope to see profitability arriving.
Yes, this is AIM, but had it been another profitable company they could have been faced with a class action law suit over this. Normal on AIM though and I need to remember that and believe nothing that the CEO says.
In fact my investing for the long term is finished. From now on, after I clear out will be pure trading.
As with many boards, the same old same old stuff occurs.
First and foremost, it is you and you alone (putting aside syndicate or some crazy ransom scheme with a gun to your head (obs joking here)) that chose when to buy, when to sell, top up etc etc, you alone to do due diligence on any given company of interest and therefore you alone that has either made money or lost money, not forgetting of course if you haven’t sold then that would be “at a loss” or “in profit” so to speak.
I can get frustration, I can get it if results weren’t as good as you’d hoped (let alone the company themselves) but it’s ultimately down to you and you alone to make that decision when you feel it best in that said current status.
Not here to battle, and not meaning to pick out specific people, but I’m merely using the following as examples....
Yanis, for example, all the rage over past months, ramping it up, topped up here, topped up there, it won’t go below x y and z.....and so on....
likewise a few others doing the same and now because you either didn’t listen, had blinkers on, remain level headed....and all the other aspects that could be listed.... for whatever they are..... you just need to accept that you didn’t “time” it right or took the wrong decision, etc etc.
To be fair to this msg and to who it goes out to..... I too, when first investing in Eve, bought in, all excited as I had a low entry, it went down more, averaged down, sub 2.5 average.... went through those spikes, got greedy, then went 2/3 rds out at a lower price. Lost out on about 12k profit, albeit made plenty. Yes, very frustrated but did I moan and groan and blame others ......? No, not once. It was my doings. I then kinda did the same thing and held on for those next spikes, eventually accepting that this is a much longer play and I’d rather try and make money elsewhere. Since then, kept sensible leaving out emotion and loyalty and keeping an eye on Eve as I still believe in Eve but it’s not ready or strong enough as yet...imo.
Not once, have I moaned, groaned or blamed anyone else for my doings. And now, when I post the odd comment on here I try to be constructive and share with you all how I see it all panning out. Funnily enough trying to help in my way for us all to benefit as best we can.
Blast, time, gotta whizz.... gl all, genuinely..... UNB1
Oh dear … back down to 2.40p. We are done!.Selling is not over yet.
The good thing is that the selling seems to have stopped yesterday. Fingers crossed.
'Reading here and indeed the AFVDN ( or whatever the initials are) several people have just thrown in the towel yesterday in disgust and sold their holdings.'
– Yes, noticed that. Someone called Clocktower who's been posting for ages. Probably already regretting. There's a deramper there called Terminator who had been nagging Ct for just as long.
Funny how we all interpret the same info quite differently.
A ray oh hope from the arm chair trader
“ Finally, a notable mention for Eve Sleep [LON:EVE] which drifted 31% lower off the back of a full year trading update. That’s despite some impressive headline numbers such as two year growth of 11% off a 40% lower marketing spend. The company does however remain loss-making.”
Some savvy people now picking up all the sellers stock from yesterday ( after they sold out in disgust). It’s quite sad that this has happened though. It’s not very fair!
Reading here and indeed the AFVDN ( or whatever the initials are) several people have just thrown in the towel yesterday in disgust and sold their holdings.
green shoots already..
'2.70 740,335 Buy* 2.50 2.70 19.99k '
Yeap Yani —— I’m left a feeling of having been hoodwinked all along with the present board. It not easy now to have any faith or trust in anything they say!
Dontgiveup, I know how you feel, my average is 5.34p and £30k down at the moment. Really annoyed with been fooled … sustainable profitability changing to breakeven for PART of the business. Disgraceful.
I would like to know to Yanis. How come up to yesterday everything was positive and now profitable is further off than it ever was under CC & co?
My average is 5.5p.
im also dissapointed with the results like everyone - but give this more time - i do wish i bought at these prices and not at 10p
this mattress company will surprise us but i dont think this year or may be even next - 2024 i think we start hitting profitability
I am no expert in managing companies and no idea about selling mattresses. However, the facts the way I see it.
1. Yesterday we had a TU, the SP after very briefly touching nearly 4p fell on heavy sell volume and it now sits at 2.4p. This tells me that the market did not like what it read and heard yesterday.
2. In last year’s presentation both CC & TP where very upbeat, very confident, projected sustainable profitability this year and said that they have enough cash in hand to see Eve to sustainable profitability this year. This yesterday was not the story - downbeat and no profitability this year and now profitability is some time in the future since France is not going to catch up with UK&I until art least another 3 or 4 years. Also, cash in hand are only enough for this year, no confidence in enough cash to see us to profitability. Something has changed. What is it?
DGU - think you have some fundamental misunderstandings about the company you are invested in.
"each mattress sold is a mattress customer out or the market for 10 years approx" - please do at least a basic level of research ... we heard Cheryl state they target the more "sleep challenged" market who are more affluent and thus likely to have more than one bedroom to kit out. There's also customers upgrading mattresses for their children or purchasing sleep away and wider additional items.
You advocate less discounting and less sales ... but seem to fail to understand that in a highly competitive market where Emma, Simba and others are heavily discounting that would essentially close the entire eve business, not simply "downscale it".
As far as I'm concerned eve have pretty much hit their promised commitments for the past 2+ years on their turnaround plan, and it's your misplaced optimism and hope for better that is causing you to be disappointed. In the presentation Cheryl mentioned, from memory, that somewhere around £30m sales seems to be the point they can start achieving economies and scale and profitability - so it seems misguided to advocate they avoid this target in your short sighted desire for more immediate and less sustainable returns.
Suggesting radical leadership changes is a fairly silly response in my opinion, this is a heavy hitting board of directors who must have confidence in Cheryl's projections. To think we know better than their collective business experience on how to hit profitability ... well i'll leave that there :)
.. and in 2020 a 2 million report loss with 25.5 odd million turnover and then 2021 with the higher turnover of 26.5 ofd then a 2.9 million reported loss. It seems the more they turnover the bigger the loss - go figure.
Presently, and with the available public information disclosed, not at all happy with how the company appears to be ‘progressing’.