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"I don't blame VM for sweating their assets, as the right off for a full network redesign would wipe them out"
I meant write off lol, DOH.
"The next part of the sentence explains docsis doesn’t need electrical component. .... it’s not difficult, especially when I next detail why the other stuff is not an advantage. "
Whereas BT are moving to more efficient brand new PON Local Access Networks with a Cloud backbone network, VM appear to be sweating their current assets to the limit. I don't blame VM for sweating their assets, as the right off for a full network redesign would wipe them out. What's clear is that BT's new network will be cheaper to run and maintain, and therefore offer better margins. As much as CATV networks were higher capacity at the turn of the century, the same wont be true with the FTTP network rollouts.
There you go again Fleccy
By using context & thinking can easily see I meant to say not powering cabinets is an advantage. The next part of the sentence explains docsis doesn’t need electrical component. .... it’s not difficult, especially when I next detail why the other stuff is not an advantage. Although, I understand some street cabinets are being converted to EV chargers
"Meanwhile the competing network can offer 1gig+ to 17 million premises today"
By your reasoning then, why aren't customers flocking to them, and why is VM's revenue so much lower than BT's?
VM's revenue for 2020 was just over £5 Billion, O2's revenue is just over £6.2 Billion, so the combined entity generates less than £12 Billion.
NTL/VM have been around for a long long time, why didn't they wipe the floor with BT years ago if they're so good?
"Powering cabinets is an advantage & with respect to DOCSIS you fail to mention RFOG, which misses out co-ax"
How can needing to power a cabinet be described as an advantage?
Cabinets use Electricity, which is an ongoing expense.
Cabinets need battery backup, which requires maintenance and replacement.
The Equipment installed within the cabinet needs maintenance and repair.
There are three components making up the local access section of a PON.
They are:
1) The OLT at the head end.
2) The ONT's at the customer premises.
3) The Passive Fibre/Splitters, from the OLT to the ONT's.
PON is more reliable:
Providing the Fibre isn't dug up, or damaged, there's nothing to maintain between the head end and the customer premises.
Since the Fibre is passive, there's no requirement for batteries, power supplies, and customer facing equipment in the street.
Since the ONT's are powered by the customer, BT only need to power head end equipment.
RFOG, does indeed utilise Fibre instead of Coax, but still relies on the same equipment design at the head end, so may be lacking. I've never worked in Cable TV directly, so I admit I don't fully understand the technicalities around Cable Tv network architecture, but I did work in telecommunications for nearly 40 years in total, so I do understand the technicalities of Network Transmission.
Once FTTP is fully rolled out, and all the copper assets are retired, BT/Openreach network will be:
Much simpler
More easily maintained
Less power usage, so greener
Cheaper to run with a much smaller building footprint
More versatile for customer facing services
I just can't think of any advantage of having powered street cabinets/Equipment's over GPON. Aus I'm interested to read your list of advantages?
Fleccy sometimes I wonder whether you deliberately don’t understand the point, or you don’t understand
All you are doing is describing two competing networks, with a ridiculous bias towards only (which doesn’t actually exist yet)
Fibre over coax I agree is technically better, same as Betamax was better than VHS. But VHS was there, easily available & did what consumers needed
Yes a fibre connection could be faster, but the need for that kind of faster doesn’t & probably will never exist. If it did, then the backbone needed to support it would be a challenge. Therefore the capAbility to supply 10/100 or 1000gig in an access layer is bogus for foreseeable future. It’s actually no reason at all.
Powering cabinets is an advantage & with respect to DOCSIS you fail to mention RFOG, which misses out co-ax
The most important part of this equation is business. Yes Access fibre connections could support speeds no one will ever need across a backbone that couldn’t exist but 5 to 10 years time at best
Meanwhile the competing network can offer 1gig+ to 17 million premises today.....
I’m talking home bb because business have different connectivity options up to & including no co-ax
Meanwhile new access networks from BT’s completion are all fibre, not being built at the same rate as BT openreach, but they don’t need to do they?
This is the commercial competition to BT, not your one sided techno babble nonsense or your uninformed technical opinions.
"10GbE can use either copper or fiber cabling. Maximum distance over copper cable is 100 meters but because of its bandwidth requirements, higher-grade cables are required."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10_Gigabit_Ethernet#:~:text=Like%20previous%20versions%20of%20Ethernet,higher%2Dgrade%20cables%20are%20required.
Had a quick look at the Teleste Remote Physical Interface, and I don't see how it changes anything. VM still need powered cabinets, and if they want to offer 10G symmetrical, they'd have to replace the coaxial section with Fibre.
The following paragraph makes no sense to me, unless they mean for existing Cable companies, using DOCSYS, where the costs involved in a full network redesign to FTTP, and scrapping the existing Cable TV infrastructure, would be cripplingly expensive.
"Today and in the coming years, the DOCSIS solutions offer superior TCO benefits in comparison to technologies such as FTTH."
https://www.teleste.com/broadband-network/products/remote-phy-nodes-rpd
Total cost of Ownership of an installed Passive Fibre, has to be far less than the cost of powering and maintaining a piece of equipment in a remote cabinet.
"UNDERSTANDING TOTAL COST OF OWNERSHIP (TCO)"
https://www.graco.com/us/en/in-plant-manufacturing/solutions/articles/how-to-calculate-total-cost-of-ownership.html
https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2021/04/virgin-media-uk-trial-telestes-distributed-access-architecture.html
Plenty of interesting links at the bottom of the page.
Just to add to my last post.
Since the new VM/O2 company will start out with £18 Billion in long term debt, and revenue only around £12 Billion they have to talk the talk, since they'll also be approaching the bond market for a further £10 Billion, to finance infrastructure spend.
This narrative that VM is somehow better, or more technologically advanced than BT is false in my opinion. BT seem to be doing everything right, and investors will be rewarded in the future.
"doubt it"
You're right to doubt it lol.
I don't dispute that 2.2Gb/s is easily enough for the majority of users, for years to come, but my point was around the versatility of FTTP to offer bespoke services to business users. The limitation of HFC is the Coax from the cabinet to the customer, and the fact that the cabinets require power to provide service. Because FTTP is passive all the way from the head end to the customer, you can potentially offer select customers 10G, or 100G, symmetrical service over the same fibre as the GPON service just by fitting a box at the customer site, and hooking up to a card at the head end via a splitter combiner. If VM wanted to offer 100G, they would have to look at spare fibres in the cabinet, run Fibre from the cabinet to the customer, with the process being way more complicated than using wavelengths separate to standard GPON wavelengths over an FTTP service.
Aus HFC is just inferior to FTTP, I don't think you'll find any articles suggesting that HFC is superior to FTTP. Upgrading to Docsys 3.1 just delays VM going to a full fibre operating model, which they'll have to do at some point. I'm guessing that VM's Head End Equipment is a generation behind as well, as it's geared toward a cable TV operating model, rather than a full cloud operating model based on FTTP.
I don't think it's a coincidence that BT are moving toward a full FTTP model, with the Telereal Trillium sale and rent back lease agreement coming to and end around 2031. BT will be a much leaner and efficient company 10 years from now, VM will be playing catch up.
True
doubt it
Maybe next time a sensible conversation can be had rather than pretend nonsense about BT’s competition
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.techradar.com/uk/amp/news/virgin-media-delivers-2gbps-broadband-speeds