We would love to hear your thoughts about our site and services, please take our survey here.
London South East prides itself on its community spirit, and in order to keep the chat section problem free, we ask all members to follow these simple rules. In these rules, we refer to ourselves as "we", "us", "our". The user of the website is referred to as "you" and "your".
By posting on our share chat boards you are agreeing to the following:
The IP address of all posts is recorded to aid in enforcing these conditions. As a user you agree to any information you have entered being stored in a database. You agree that we have the right to remove, edit, move or close any topic or board at any time should we see fit. You agree that we have the right to remove any post without notice. You agree that we have the right to suspend your account without notice.
Please note some users may not behave properly and may post content that is misleading, untrue or offensive.
It is not possible for us to fully monitor all content all of the time but where we have actually received notice of any content that is potentially misleading, untrue, offensive, unlawful, infringes third party rights or is potentially in breach of these terms and conditions, then we will review such content, decide whether to remove it from this website and act accordingly.
Premium Members are members that have a premium subscription with London South East. You can subscribe here.
London South East does not endorse such members, and posts should not be construed as advice and represent the opinions of the authors, not those of London South East Ltd, or its affiliates.
I thought is was 1GB by 2020.
DW you’re back to your usual tricks of posting multiple times and sounding hysterical. Your bitterness towards Bond is palpable. Suggest you leave the board for a few weeks and calm down. I’m putting you back on ignore again as I don’t need to read your multiple repetitive and quite frankly tiresome posts.
HD
Excellent post. How the real world works.
Nothing announced is NOT evidence of nothing happening.
Hi HD,
thanks, agreed and understood.
Most investors realise this however there is a hard core of whiners for whom patience and logic do not apply. Their motivations are unclear. But, like children, when the SP heads up again they will be right there at the front posting wildly optimistic comments with daft rhetoric such as "see you all on the beaches" "£10 by the end of the week" etc. So, excellent as your analysis is im afraind for them its pearls before swine. For the rest of us thanks and agreed. No guarantees however with aim.
The title of this tread is ridiculous, all LTH here are fully aware that for AFC "tomorrow never comes" it's a historical issue for them.
Now you can filter me, it must be a lie
I’ve been a visitor to this board (and previously the ii forum) for several years and I’m part of what I’d like to think is a silent majority that doesn’t post much (or maybe that's just me) but I would like to dampen some of the concerns regarding the lack of orders so far.
As someone involved on the technical side of specifying and requisitioning power generation equipment on behalf of an end customer, I can only give testament to the amount of time it takes to go through the bidding and evaluation process up to eventual order placement. In my industry (oil and gas) a very good outcome would be to have bids generated, received and evaluated, and an order placed within 3 months of an enquiry, and that would be for standard, proven kit (small turbine or gas/diesel engine). 6 months would not be unusual, nor would 9 months, especially if an end user doesn’t really know what it needs, or keeps changing its spec, requiring a supplier to re-tender. I am aware that in other industries the process can take even longer, especially when selling to the public sector.
In this case, with AFC’s fuel cell system, the customer is buying in to novel technology, and is starting from a point where it doesn’t have any expert understanding of what’s in the box nor what it has to provide outside the box to make it all work. The customer ought to do its own due diligence into the technology. The extent to which the customer will do this depends on the criticality of the intended application and the resources available to do the work. This would involve assessment of technical readiness and qualification status of the overall equipment and key components. The customer might ask for independent studies, such as FMECA, to understand consequences of component failure. At the end of all this, once the technical/procurement team is ready to recommend a supplier’s equipment for purchase, then there are budget holders and their operations staff to be convinced – all of which takes TIME.
Adam Bond has told us in June (?) that he has several qualified enquiries on his desk. That is good enough for me, as an investor, for now. Now we have to wait and be patient for AFC and the potential customers to do their work.
GLA
DW won’t be saying anything positive today as he’ll be licking his PHE wounds, although he has a fair point about comms on that bb. Likewise Daz, if as stated he bought into PHE recently.
Why are you still invested is beyond me. Same for your cronies garmoan and daz!
Snag is southerhay you don't be know the reason for the silence anymore than the rest of us. You're just surmising it's because they're busy working away preparing everything for orders. What if that's not correct. Then what. It's not good to leave investors guessing at such a critical time in the company's development.
DW - you know full well that IT has transformed comms since he joined AFC. There must be a very good reason for the silence and that they’re working towards the “outlook “ items stated in the last report issued by AFC. I can understand your frustration but your constant impatient swipes are tedious. There’s a massive amount going on behave scenes getting the new facility up and running. Let them get on with that and hopefully ABB design will be close now. September is more likely for news as it’s now holiday season but that’s just my guess.
When an RNS eventually comes it better be good. Anything other than confirmation of significant orders will not go down well with the market I fear. Let's hope we all get rewarded for our ongoing CV patience. I agree with DW about the PR i.e. it's non existent, which is a poor show given the specific resources we have for this purpose.
Why would they build any until they know they have firm orders?
Croqman. I remain pretty patient, but it's declining a little, month on month. Many savvy investors will fairly think "it's a very slow burn here, so I'll invest elsewhere and return when the sp shows sign of life." As an investor, remaining static, or below the January sp level for the following year makes little sense with so many options in the market. I'm a technology believer, but the clock is ticking, both for demonstration of commercial viability and for the longevity of the directors.
I don't think anyone is suggesting that anyone should be patient here for another decade.
If posters cannot see the progress made here in the last year alone, the new/renewed focus on this sector since the back end of last year, and the opportunities that this presents, then there really is no hope, imo.
The SP is not indicative of anything wrong here
Holding, patient and happy to wait for news.
As myself, and others have been saying for months, come back at the end of year. If nothing of substance by then, then your concerns will be more justified
gla
Garonne, BP Shell and a million other companies are at risk from share price volatility, AIM is a few step up the risky ladder. It’s the investing game, if you can’t stay calm then leave the room.
Yes, we know...
It's not the "rolling heads" that would concern me in such a scenario it would be the collapsing SP.
Aim & Daz. Perhaps we need a little balance here. On the one hand, selling is a far easier option than constant moaning, or de-ramping, or whatever is going on here. In contrast, none of us can be patient for another decade and, to be fair, AFC does need to up the anti wrt communications. The very occasional "trust me" RNS is no longer sufficient and we need tangible of progress, ideally orders. If not, then shortly, the question will become "can they actually make this seemingly great technology commercially viable?" The history of corporate failures is full of businesses with the best product that could not be manufactured economically, so AB needs to demonstrate AFC wont be another addition to this list.
If there was no prospect of orders, the production facility and workforce increases would be negligent actions by the BODs and judgement would dictate those making the decisions would be no longer fit for management.
So there must be orders or rolling heads. We will see which it is.
And lets not forget that although most RNSs for AFC come at 7am they do not control the news and an order could drop at any time of day and it could just be minutes, days, weeks or months away. We havn't heard of any production problems so I assume there will be a mountain of stored units rolling off the production line, stacked up outside the Dunsfold factory and possibly visible from the M25 pretty soon. Lots to look forward to though!
Vagisol more like...
whilst no news for a prolonged period of time is not ideal, ie the doubters and naysayers spring forth, I recall being invested in centamin eygpt some 20 odd years ago, when the egyptian mining authority suspended their mining licence for 18 or so months....nothing happened period...the licence eventually got restored and i made a handsome profit eventually...But boy was patience required there....at least i know that with AFC there is a HUGE ammount going on behind the scenes....GLALTH.
Yes. Dragons Den is truly a realistic depiction of investing. Infact, everything shown on TV today is true. Love Island etc.
Aim, have you never watched Dragons Den ? It's quite normal for investors to want to see a return after 1-2 years, i've been waiting over 6 years and many a lot longer.
AB's nose has clearly grown with the comment about asking advisors seeking how best to announce the orderbook, it doesn't take that long, maybe AB is hoping they will actually have an orderbook by the time shareholders start demanding news.